SkadollaX Posted October 5, 2007 Posted October 5, 2007 (edited) Spent the entire morning calling all of the paint manufacturers to see if anyone actually produced a paint specific for Projector screens. Seems obvious right, well not really....no one thinks we exist Anyways.... What I did discover is that British Paints make a product that actually states on the can (has pictures of people sitting around watching front PJ) that it is for projector screens. It is called "British Paints Ultra Flat". I know about sprog goo but I find it hard to get and overly expensive. So for those of you looking for a cheap alternative you may want to take a look at this product. 4litres ($50.00) 2litres ($30.00) Can be had at any Bunnings store! Hope you find it useful. I'm going to grab a tin tonight and I'll post up my thoughts sometime next week.... Edited October 5, 2007 by SkadollaX
ols Posted October 5, 2007 Posted October 5, 2007 (edited) Spent the entire morning calling all of the paint manufacturers to see if anyone actually produced a paint specific for Projector screens.Seems obvious right, well not really....no one thinks we exist Anyways.... What I did discover is that British Paints make a product that actually states on the can (has pictures of people sitting around watching front PJ) that it is for projector screens. It is called "British Paints Ultra Flat". I know about sprog goo but I find it hard to get and overly expensive. So for those of you looking for a cheap alternative you may want to take a look at this product. 4litres ($50.00) 2litres ($30.00) Can be had at any Bunnings store! Hope you find it useful. I'm going to grab a tin tonight and I'll post up my thoughts sometime next week.... I can assure you the British Paints product is not "special" paint for a projector screen. The suggestion is that it's an ultra flat finish (no light reflection) and good "whiteness" (if you buy the white base) which amongst other uses makes it an ideal paint for projector screens. People have their different ideas on flatness and whiteness too Do a search through the projector forum for "painted screens" and you will have plenty to look at. That's even without going into the painted wall vs projector screen arguments Edited October 5, 2007 by ols
mazman1503559902 Posted October 5, 2007 Posted October 5, 2007 Ive already tried it. Here are a few screen shots of the british paint your talking about, it's the top right hand side, ive just named it "home theater matt white" Ive compared it to a few other paints etc, the one on the top left is your standard block out fabric, untouched, while the bottom ones are painted. http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d109/maz...testing0073.jpg http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d109/maz...testing0071.jpg http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d109/maz...testing0074.jpg http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d109/maz...testing0054.jpg
CAVX Posted October 5, 2007 Posted October 5, 2007 These paints also have a gain of around 0.8, so you really need a dark room... Mark
SteveC1503561276 Posted October 5, 2007 Posted October 5, 2007 (edited) So Is the 'white shaver' the preferred paint from these examples, or do you prefer the silver(s)? Steve Edited October 5, 2007 by SteveC
senverse Posted October 5, 2007 Posted October 5, 2007 I find it astounding that anyone would use paint instead of a proper screen for a projector. At least use Screen Goo, cost what? a couple hundred bucks. You spend all that money on a projector and display it like that... I'm sorry but thats like buying a FULL HD plasma or LCD and using it to watch VHS tapes. I did the whole white wall thing and only after I got a proper screen did i realise what i was missing. I may as well have worn sun glasses before. Spend the extra money and do it right! You won't regret it and it will always be there, even when you change projectors.
mazman1503559902 Posted October 5, 2007 Posted October 5, 2007 you would be amazed at what you could get out of a good paint mix, or a melamine board that i have found! I have put a material sample of a $1000 screen against teh melamine board thats $50, you can hardly tell the colour difference! so obviously, to me, it was not worth to pay teh extra $950 for no visable difference to my eyes. Is it so you can just say, ooh look, i have a real $3000 screen?
mazman1503559902 Posted October 5, 2007 Posted October 5, 2007 (edited) So Is the 'white shaver' the preferred paint from these examples, or do you prefer the silver(s)?Steve i went with neither at the end, i found a excellent melamine board that rivals the top screens, so i choise that instead. When i experimented, i found for a lighter room(or if you prefered persieved blacker blacks), the silverstone with clear coat was prefered, but if you had a total dark room, the white shaver with clear coat was pretty good. Even the block out material was better then the british paint. But the melamine kills'em all Edited October 5, 2007 by mazman
larry42 Posted October 5, 2007 Posted October 5, 2007 mazman-where did you get the melamine board from ?
SkadollaX Posted October 5, 2007 Author Posted October 5, 2007 The paint I purchased is for use in my garage. For those gaming\drinking nights with the boys.... Every product has it's purpose.....and let me tell you that if you simply want a good screen at an affordable price then there is nothing better than a lick of paint. I can have a screen 3m wide, 2m wide, 1m wide just by hitting the zoom, you can't do that with a screen (well you could go smaller but not bigger). I have a couple of screens and I tested one of them "screen technics" against the somewhat freshly painted wall. I think the picture looked stunning, way better than the white\grey that was previously on that wall and on par'ish with the screen. And I LMFA to those that say painted walls are not for PJ's. At the end of the day beauty is in the eye of the beholder. So for those of you happy enough not to have a model for a wife\girl friend then I'd recommend this paint to you......
SkadollaX Posted October 5, 2007 Author Posted October 5, 2007 I find it astounding that anyone would use paint instead of a proper screen for a projector.At least use Screen Goo, cost what? a couple hundred bucks. You spend all that money on a projector and display it like that... I'm sorry but thats like buying a FULL HD plasma or LCD and using it to watch VHS tapes. I did the whole white wall thing and only after I got a proper screen did i realise what i was missing. I may as well have worn sun glasses before. Spend the extra money and do it right! You won't regret it and it will always be there, even when you change projectors. I find it astounding that anyone would not. Why use screen goo? Because you have read about it or because you have actually used it and compared it to paint for yourself? You did the white wall thing...so what paint did you use? or was it your old whitish wall in the living room that you base your comparison on? I disagree with everything you just said.
SkadollaX Posted October 5, 2007 Author Posted October 5, 2007 you would be amazed at what you could get out of a good paint mix! Agreed... AND I know this is not the perfect paint in a can projector screen product but it does fit the bill for alot of people looking to get into the world of front projection without the need of an expensive screen. Also My kids have in the past messed my screen up pretty bad. I don't want to punish them they are 5 & 3 and don't need me telling them what not touch every single minute of the day. They are young, they need to experiment and discover things and just because I chose to fill the house up with expensive toys doesn't mean they need to tip toe around everything... In the future I would consider replacing my screen in the house with a painted wall as that is what is behind it any way. If the kids mess it up or it gets dirty I simply hit it with another coat.
xdZ Posted October 5, 2007 Posted October 5, 2007 Mazman: can you post some pics of the melamine board pic quality?
Platinum1503560545 Posted October 6, 2007 Posted October 6, 2007 we all have different houses, different rooms different expectations & different EYES in the end we all get a different experience to Enjoy.
Platinum1503560545 Posted October 6, 2007 Posted October 6, 2007 mazman-where did you get the melamine board from ? any decent cabinet maker can order you a piece of MDF covered in flat white melamine or laminate. not expensive, just cumbersome to transportas you dont want the board in 2 pieces..
mazman1503559902 Posted October 6, 2007 Posted October 6, 2007 mazman-where did you get the melamine board from ? Here in nsw, i found it at bunnings. In the link i will provide( down the bottom) it has all the info if you are interested. Mazman: can you post some pics of the melamine board pic quality? Sure can Instead of me posting a link one by one, is it ok if i just post a link to the avs site ive made a thread on it? You will see i have pics of this board with SD dvd and comparison with a quality screen material as well, just go through and read it all. http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=865595 And here are just a few shots on the same melamine board but using HD blu ray with an aussiemorphic lens mkII.(just got the blu ray setup so not many pics). Post no#33 http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread....8069&page=2 If you cant see the pictures, or need to be members to view, let me know and ill direct link the pics.
Tweet Posted October 6, 2007 Posted October 6, 2007 Mazman, I've used a large sheet of flat white melamine board from Bunnings for my first screen many years ago and I can say this for certain it was simply dreadful for hotspotting and crushed whites. If you look at those photos you provided on the avsforum you will see that all the detail has been lost in the highlights, the whites are overly bright and are washing out the detail in them. Certainly melamine board gives a bright reflected image but really brightness isn't everything and soon becomes tiring to the eye. Less than perfect screens also act as optical filters and can bias the colour balance of the reflected light. Unless the projector and the screen are calibrated 'as one' what you end up with is just another 'Ureaka' DIY screen that looks good in one movie and lacking in another. It is akin to designing a loudspeaker using records and CD's to tune the best acoustic performance out of it. It is such a hit and miss affair that it is largely a waste of time. Projectors and screens should be treated as the same optical device and calibrated in a light controlled room. I have recently tested the British Paints Utra Flat paint on a large curved screen and found it to be bright and very clear and with good colour balance, for the settings on MY projector ( a Z4). What I did notice was that it needed a little 'Lamp Black' to be added to the mix to improve the overall contrast a little, apart from that it would be a good choice as a screen paint. If you do use it, use British Paints primer as a base coat on MDF sheeting. http://britishpaints.com.au/index.asp?page=10 Here you are if you want some ideas....... http://www.bigscreenforums.com/forum_browse.cfm?which=16 C.M
mazman1503559902 Posted October 6, 2007 Posted October 6, 2007 (edited) Im not sure if you read the thread, but you MUST coat it with clear matt acrylic if using this board, this will solve teh hotspotting issue's, otherwise you will have the problems you experianced. Im not sure where you see im losing detail! Again, if you went through it all, you will see i compared a well known screen material from oztheatre (evo3d) and the two basically blended in, so to me its a big archivement to get my screen as close as possable to the evo3d material, wich everyone praises about! Like i said before, i have tested the british home theatre paint, and i would rather have a block out cloth instead... Edited October 6, 2007 by mazman
senverse Posted October 6, 2007 Posted October 6, 2007 I find it astounding that anyone would not. Why use screen goo? Because you have read about it or because you have actually used it and compared it to paint for yourself?You did the white wall thing...so what paint did you use? or was it your old whitish wall in the living room that you base your comparison on? I disagree with everything you just said. I have seen the goo at work and its not too bad but the surface its painted on needs to be well prepared and I can't say I have seen too many walls that are perfectly flat and damage free. Streaks and inconsistant painting can show up too. If you a happy enough with a white wall then best of luck to you. I want a good quality screen that also looks nice in my theatre and enjoy the show and not think "is my DIY good enough and can I make it better." I leave the arts and crafts for my 2 year old. Lets agree to disagree! I can appreciate the potential savings but to me its not worth the effort or my time.
Electric_Haggis Posted March 23, 2011 Posted March 23, 2011 (edited) Ive already tried it.Here are a few screen shots of the british paint your talking about, it's the top right hand side, ive just named it "home theater matt white" Ive compared it to a few other paints etc, the one on the top left is your standard block out fabric, untouched, while the bottom ones are painted. http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d109/maz...testing0073.jpg http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d109/maz...testing0071.jpg http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d109/maz...testing0074.jpg http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d109/maz...testing0054.jpg Interesting!!! That "white shaver" is looking like a good middle-ground. What paint/primer did you use for that? It's melamine, right? Thanks in advance. Edited March 23, 2011 by Haggis2
idrabble1503563286 Posted March 25, 2011 Posted March 25, 2011 the surface its painted on needs to be well prepared and I can't say I have seen too many walls that are perfectly flat and damage free. Streaks and inconsistant painting can show up too. I have never watched my projector on a wall but I would imagine that that this would be the greatest problem. I would think that you can get a very good paint colour for a screen but a wall is never going to have the uniform appearance that a screen has. Ian
cray- Posted March 25, 2011 Posted March 25, 2011 Wall material may affect the uniformity of the wall. I have lived in Vic and WA and the building techniques are quite different. Vic houses are generally timber frames with an exterior brick veneer, inside is Gyprock sheets with the joins smoothed over. If the frame is out and there is a height difference in the boards, I imagine it would take a LOT of sanding to bring it back into line. In WA double brick is more common with single fast-brick interior walls. These then have a rough render followed by a thick liquid plaster (I'm not familiar with the proper names for these products & finishes). Since this is applied by hand, the final finish comes down tot he skill of the tradie doing the job. Irregularities in the wall's surface tend to catch the eye since the projector's image moves around and the imperfections stay still. If the wall is prepared well, a painted finish is more than capable and worthy of most projectors.
kimmik Posted March 25, 2011 Posted March 25, 2011 (edited) both of your comments are based on hypothesizing, not actual experience with a painted screen on gyprock or similar wall surfaces. imperfections are negligible. the paint is flat (2% gloss), which means the angle of incident and angle of reflection do not affect the brightness of image. http://img269.imageshack.us/i/img4800large.jpg/ this is my room (in an earlier state) with the british paint screen. ppl who watch something in my room often ask me how much the screen costed me, thinking that the screen is the source of the fantastic picture lol as for screen uniformity, i've both measured it, and taken photos of a blank white (to look for signs of obvious imperfection). the answer is, the projector has 20% of uniformity problem across the image, screen has negligible. screen also has no visible imperfection on the projected image. Edited March 25, 2011 by kimmik
Tweet Posted March 25, 2011 Posted March 25, 2011 (edited) I used that British Paint Ultra Flat White on an 2400mm x 1200mm x 6mm flat panel secured to an 18mm MDF panel underneath.This arrangement allowed me to experiment with different painted panels of the same size easy enough to lift and secure by myself. In the end, I considered this Ultra Flat White to have the best overall colour balance, though it can be a little bright at times so just a little bit of lamp black or just a little bit of 'flat black' paint added to the mix might help. It is a matter of one's preference though.Reducing the gamma of the movie a notch or two also helps to offset this extra brightness to give a very enjoyable picture (with proper calibration of course). Yes,well I found it an excellent paint for my needs though I am still considering using a Laminex ' Polar White' maybe with the Flint Finish, a matte laminex sheet. Such screens are highly durable when it comes to the artistic talents of small children.....can be easily cleaned. C.M Edited March 29, 2011 by Tweet
cray- Posted March 28, 2011 Posted March 28, 2011 both of your comments are based on hypothesizing, not actual experience with a painted screen on gyprock or similar wall surfaces. When I said "uniformity" I was referring to how smooth the wall is, bumps, lumps, overall flatness. I didn't mean the uniformity of the projected light, sorry for the confusion. Yes there was a bit of hypothesising, I can imagine a particularly badly prepped Gyprock wall looking rubbish. But I was actually agreeing with the idea that painted walls can look great! My experience is with a liquid plaster wall in WA, I helped my in-laws setup their HT almost 4 years ago. I was amazed at the quality of the image from their 720 DLP projector throwing a 120" picture in a light controlled room with walls & ceiling painted a deep maroon. We initially projected onto the existing off-white wall before doing the Screen Goo treatment. Even before the Goo the picture was incredible. I'm all for painted screens, especially if the budget is tight.
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