Shonky* Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 I just had a horrible realisation that under the AFL contract, Ten must show AFL on it's main channel (digital 10 and analogue) so that viewers without digital TV's will be able to view the AFL.From April next year with digital TenSD simulcast and paired with analogue, and OneHD simulcast and paired with OneSD (12), the AFL will no longer be shown in HD unless all FOUR channels show the AFL at the same time!!!! TEN really will be the sports channel from next year..... Really it's only THREE channels. The analogue channel will *always* show the same as LCN 10 until analogue switches off. And even then it's only TWO channels since 1=12 (which I think is just dumb)
IanD1503559705 Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 Yep, sure will as the picture quality of all their channels will take a pitiful dive and never again be as good as what we have now. DVD's will look so much better than what will be broadcast on FTA and pay TV from 2009 on.You'd think the digital revolution would actually improve the viewing experience! Excessive compression here we come... If you believe the rumours, the studios are already dumbing down the quality of DVD compared to what it used to be, in order to make HD look better and therefore more attractive to the consumer to take up. I think this represents a universal cutting of corners in the quality arena to make any offering more "efficient" for the studios. As far as digital TV, I remember when ABC used to be at over 6Mbps and it looked fantastic, but I notice the loss in quality (mainly sharpness) when they dropped it down to just over 5Mbps. When it comes to internet TV, I notice the resolution is less than DVD or SDTV, so we can't expect better quality there either. There is a lot of concern about excessive DNR being applied to some Bluray movies. It has been suspected that this was because the average consumer doesn't like the grain of film and prefers the "cleaner" look of video, but I'm wondering whether it is actually the first step in permitting a reduction in bitrate (detail filtered out permits greater compression) and the ability to fit more movies on smaller and cheaper discs. The future for quality versus quantity is looking increasingly grim IMO.
davmel Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 Really it's only THREE channels. The analogue channel will *always* show the same as LCN 10 until analogue switches off. And even then it's only TWO channels since 1=12 (which I think is just dumb) Well no, it's 4 channels - 3 digital, 1 analogue. Just like the 3 channel simulcast on analogue, SD and HD we had for nearly 7 years.
Shonky* Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 No. You're ****ing about the fact the it's 4 channels broadcasting the same thing. Two of those (LCN10 and analogue 10) must be simulcast by law. Nothing 10 can do about that. The "3 channel simulcast" as you call it has largely disappeared this year. Have a look at LCN 1. It has a lot of alternative programming. And the other are tied together by the law anyway.
MACCA350 Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 (edited) If you believe the rumours, the studios are already dumbing down the quality of DVD compared to what it used to be, in order to make HD look better and therefore more attractive to the consumer to take up.It's funny you say that as I mentioned the exact thing a long time ago. One that stood out was Harry Potter - Order of the Phoenix..........I saw the DVD and it's quality was absolutely shocking, extremely poor compared previous blockbusters cheers Edited October 30, 2008 by MACCA350
yabbal Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 (edited) Has anyone asked Ten what their plans are??? New sports digital multi-channel to launch in 2009 Media Briefing 28 October 2008(MP3) Key Notes: - Operates 24/7 - On Channel 1 in HD - On Channel 12 in SD There seems to be this mentality from alot of sports fans on the internet that if you complain about the Sports channel being in HD, to sit down and shut up, because they want the sports channel. They dont seem to realise that we are taking exception to the fact it will be available even without taking up the HD channel, so leave the HD channel alone. And it seems a number of people think that the Sci-Fi fans are only upset at losing the current niche programming on TENHD, but most sports fans watch non-sports programming at some point - if you have ever enjoyed things like House, NCIS, BurnNotice, Dexter, SuperNatural - ANYTHING ON TEN AVAILABLE IN HD - you should be very annoyed by this, even if you want the sport channel. Edited October 30, 2008 by yabbal
FeOe_Vidz Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 Maybe slightly OT, but still 10HD related. I recorded what was supposed to be Psych last night around 10.30-11.40 or so, and just going back through it on the PC and noticed it was a simulcast on regular 10, but it was in HD, as it was showing up as 1920x1080, then when Letterman came on after, it had the 10HD logo, so I knew it did record the right channel. I missed Eureka last week cos I forgot to record it, but I hope I don't miss it this week due to 10 not putting it on.
tonymy01 Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 Feoe vidz.... huh? I don't understand what you are saying. 10HD always has the logo on that channel even when playing upscaled material, but is that what you are saying? 10HD is 1920x1080 fulltime also, they don't vary the resolution depending on the show. Was Psych on? I recorded it on my Beyonwiz too, but haven't had a chance to check it yet (recorded by ICE interactive). They do simulcast stuff between SD and HD quite a bit still, esp the popular stuff like House, Supernatural etc.
des Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 (edited) (post deleted) Edited October 30, 2008 by des
wheelz Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 So are you lot going to complain when Seven and Nein launch their specialist 24/7 Lifestyle & Drama channels too? djOS if theres on thing that is certain that is that no matter what TV stations do someone from this forum wont be happy about it.
ckent Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 (edited) You haven't been reading this thread have you?There can only be one HD and two SD channels next year. TenHD is GONE, they can't keep it due to there being not enough bandwidth and the legislation prohibits more than one HD channel. Yeah but read my sentence. I said "they could've done X-Y-Z" ... I know full well what they're proposing; that's why I'm counter-proposing. Whether AFL will be continue to be shown in HD is another matter. OneHD shows AFL, and it'll be showing other sports in HD, so why not? Anyway DavMel, "it's really" only 3 channels, not 4. That's the point Shonky was making: 2 of the 4 always have to be the same thing. But sadly the way Ten is planning it, the other 2 will also be the same thing. That takes Ten's offering from 3 permissible shows at a time, down to 2. CK. Edited October 30, 2008 by ckent
djOS Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 (edited) djOS if theres on thing that is certain that is that no matter what TV stations do someone from this forum wont be happy about it. Good point. I am bracing myself for some sucky quality too folks but I do support the concept (sans extra SD simulcast channel) of a 24/7 sports channel. Edited October 30, 2008 by djOS
pgdownload Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 But sadly the way Ten is planning it, the other 2 will also be the same thing. That takes Ten's offering from 3 permissible shows at a time, down to 2. CK.Keep in mind that with the possible exception of seven the networks are financial basket cases. Finding content to support three channels of 24 hour is expensive. They also realise that these new channels are not going to magically increase viewer numbers (and ad revenue) by any significant amount. So whilst they could have arranged to have 3 unique channels, it probably doesn't make much economic sense to do so. Regards Peter Gillespie
bindi Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 Maybe slightly OT, but still 10HD related. I recorded what was supposed to be Psych last night around 10.30-11.40 or so, and just going back through it on the PC and noticed it was a simulcast on regular 10, but it was in HD, as it was showing up as 1920x1080, then when Letterman came on after, it had the 10HD logo, so I knew it did record the right channel.I missed Eureka last week cos I forgot to record it, but I hope I don't miss it this week due to 10 not putting it on. i noticed that too, i tried to record the movie after it, but i thought no big loss, i forgot about psych before it as i don't watch it, but if i did that would be a big loss in my book, i hate when my shows don't come on. hopefully they don't skip the episode on you like 9HD did when it failed to go to invasion and just remained a simulcast. you should probably ring 10, coz when 9 did it and i rang them they had no idea that it had happened. also in that case it only happened in qld, do you live in qld too or was this a national problem?
davmel Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 The "3 channel simulcast" as you call it has largely disappeared this year. Have a look at LCN 1. It has a lot of alternative programming. And the other are tied together by the law anyway. As I said, the 3 channel simulcast went on for nearly seven years (Jan 1 2001 through to Sep 2007) And it still remains mostly a 3 channel simulcast for all but a few hours of the day.
davmel Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 djOS if theres on thing that is certain that is that no matter what TV stations do someone from this forum wont be happy about it. Hey, we're just holding a public memorial service for all the HD content that will disappear from Australian TV next year. It's a major loss for Australian viewers. All the effort of producing locally made shows like Australian idol, Neighbours etc etc in HD will be for nothing. Makes you wonder if they'll continue filming Neighbours in HD - I guess so the poms can see it in HD but we'll have to put up with a highly compressed SD version!
davmel Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 OneHD shows AFL, and it'll be showing other sports in HD, so why not? OneHD can ONLY show AFL if it is already simultaneously being shown on TenSD and analogue. So as I said, the only way they will show AFL in HD is if all FOUR channels have the same thing on! A pathetic situation really. Anyway DavMel, "it's really" only 3 channels, not 4. That's the point Shonky was making: 2 of the 4 always have to be the same thing. Do you have trouble counting to 4? 1. Analogue PAL channel 2. OneHD 3. TenSD 4. OneSD They are ALL channels that can technically be independent of each other. But sadly the way Ten is planning it, the other 2 will also be the same thing. That takes Ten's offering from 3 permissible shows at a time, down to 2. No, there are currently two programming streams (analogue/TenSD & TenHD) and there will still be 2 independent streams next year (analogue/TenSD & OneHD/OneSD)
LBM Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 10HD is 1920x1080 fulltime They have been dropping Ten HD for the last few nights, obviously to change things on their end for the upcoming ONE HD. Was Psych on? It was but the movie afterwards wasn't.
davmel Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 i noticed that too, i tried to record the movie after it, but i thought no big loss Something must have happened to their scheduled 'Alien Invasion' movie last night as they dumped it for a video hits presentation and a double of Who Love's Raymond at the last minute.
pgdownload Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 So as I said, the only way they will show AFL in HD is if all FOUR channels have the same thing on! A pathetic situation really. OneHD can ONLY show AFL if it is already simultaneously being shown on TenSD and analogue.This is very likely to cease being the case next year. The anti siphoning rules are likely to allow FTA networks to show 'protected' content on a digital channel only. Regardless, I'd expect that if the rule was still in place channel 10 will simply make TenSD simulcast TenHD and OneSD will show other content. That's allowed in the rules and technically easy to do.1. Analogue PAL channel 3. TenSD These are required to be simulcast so while theoretically they can diverge, they won't. 2. OneHD 4. OneSD Again these could diverge but it would be a major waste of Tens investment in sport content (serverely curtailing potential viewing numbers) - so while they could diverge, they won't and it still remains mostly a 3 channel simulcast for all but a few hours of the day.Which is because the networks found no real value in showing different content on each channel. So we had 3 channels (4 including analogue) all showing the same content At least now we have 2 channels of totally different content.Regards Peter Gillespie
Dyllip Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 I would be happy about this channel if all the sport from the other networks moved to ONE and the other networks showed no sport what so ever. But that will never happen!
Elphinkiller Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 I will admit to being an absolute sports nut. I love nearly all types of sport. That is the sole reason I subscribe to Foxtel (the fact the kids can watch Nick jr is a bonus for them). But I am also a fan of high quality broadcast TV. The fact that they will have to reduce the bitrate is bad enough but to then have none of their supposed flagship shows in HD is absurd. When I told the wife about this last night she thought I was joking, she said to me "Nice try but I doubt you will get Ch10 doing that". When she finally realised I was serious she just shook her head. This was mentioned before and I can't see why it wouldn't have worked. A 24/7 SD sports channel and their normal programming on another SD feed, with there being a combination of the two SD feeds on the HD feed. It would mean that they could have purely native HD stuff on the HD channel (keeps the HD enthusiats happy) and still have a 24/7 sport channel (which keeps the sports nuts happy) and in turn would keep people like me, who are both, very happy. We couldn't have that though as then there would only be Native HD stuff on the HD channel and that wouldn't work.
reds4ever Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 QUOTE (vasilli @ Oct 29 2008, 02:03 AM) *I hope not, Because the EPL has up to 5 games on at once. Ten HD will be only broadcasting 1 of them so we miss out on the rest. Keep it as is I reckon Thats a fair point, although i still defently watch the main match
yabbal Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 (edited) ... channel 10 will simply make TenSD simulcast TenHD and OneSD will show other content. That's allowed in the rules and technically easy to do. And exactly what they should be doing 24/7! Normal TEN: Analogue 10 Digital SD 10 Digtial HD 1 - the hd should only simulcast the sports channel for major events, not 24/7!!!!! If TEN dont want to have 3 channels, they should go back to making 10HD an exact simulcast of 10SD like it was before. 24 Hour Sports: Digital 12 SD Edited October 30, 2008 by yabbal
ckent Posted October 30, 2008 Posted October 30, 2008 (edited) Yeah, good point PG; I had thought about that too. One way they could please everybody without any extra money (or bandwidth) is to play HD versions of what's on TenSD, on the HD channel when there's no HD-native sport on OneSD. They already get the HD versions of their normal shows. If they want to make it really easy for viewers, they could do this: During HD Sports 1______10_____11_____12_____Analogue OneSD__TenSD__OneHD__TenSD__TenSD(4:3) During no HD sport 1______10_____11_____12_____Analogue OneSD__TenSD__OneSD__TenHD__TenSD(4:3) At any given time, there's only 2 SD channels and 1 HD channel being transmitted, so it's technically no problem. (Just like Ten Digital used to do several years ago, switching the HD channel being "19" and "10" when there was a demo loop during daytime). The so-called "TenHD" would just be regular channel 10 content (like it was in mid-2007) with native HD shows when available, and upconversion when not. CK. Edited October 30, 2008 by ckent
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