MQA CD's

[powerav]

MQA CD's are coming.

 

[cafe67]

Lets hope they put some decent music on it and not just endless reissues of dylan , stones, pink floyd, eagles, steely dan 

 

Ie maybe some modern music 

[reflux075]

Wonder if they will play on a normal CD player that does digital out into a MQA DAC?

[Dolphy]

16 minutes ago, reflux075 said:

Wonder if they will play on a normal CD player that does digital out into a MQA DAC?

From what I've read you'll need an MQA compatible CD player to get the full benefit, otherwise it will only play the Red Book Layer

[Ian R-B]

34 minutes ago, cafe67 said:

Lets hope they put some decent music on it

7 minutes ago, reflux075 said:

Wonder if they will play on a normal CD player that does digital out into a MQA DAC?

A subject of much debate and one I've been following for some time. It's pretty much impossible to identify identical recordings in different formats - making true comparisons impossible. As a non classical/non trad jazz type I've always been frustrated finding stuff I like with higher res recordings. My 1st explorations comparing (the few albums I could find) proved no diff to my discs. Turned out they were just up-sampled which you can do yourself. Wonder if that holds true below ?

"An MQA CD is a Red Book CD and is 100% compatible with any existing CD player. The audio on the disc is MQA-encoded PCM, and will play back happily without a decoder. In this case, the sound quality is slightly better than a typical CD, because the audio is already de-blurred in the studio. However if the bitstream is passed to an MQA decoder, it is unfolded to 176kHz (in this case) and rendered to the DAC at 24-bit".

https://www.stereophile.com/content/mqa-encoded-cds-yes

 

[davewantsmoore]

1 hour ago, reflux075 said:

Wonder if they will play on a normal CD player that does digital out into a MQA DAC?

Yes, they will.

 

Assuming they work the way the patent/articles for MQA describe, then the 16bits available on the CD is used to store the audio at up to whatever bitrate is needed to store it transparently (estimated 13 bits) .... and then the remaining (~3) bits are used to encode all the stuff that you can get back by using an MQA decoder.

 

 

CD player with a non-MQA DAC ..... The CD player sends the 16 bits of data from the CD to the DAC .... which plays it back as 16bit audio  (3 bits of the audio is interpreted as noise).

 

 

CD player connected to a MQA DAC ..... The CD player sends the 16 bits of data from the CD to the DAC ...   The 3 bits of MQA noise are decoded to get the frequencies about 20khz.

Edited August 22, 2018 by davewantsmoore

[davewantsmoore]

1 hour ago, Ian R-B said:

A subject of much debate

I don't see it (unless I have misunderstood you).    They will absolutely play (and be MQA decoded) using a regular CD player, connected via SPDIF to a MQA-enabled DAC.

[frankn]

MQA - a subject of much debate - yes. 

Will MQA encoded discs play back on a regular CD player + non-MQA DAc ( whether integrated with CD player or seperate - yes.

 

will MQA sound better than regular CD - with or without MQA decoding is subject of much debate. 

What you hear from your gear, through your ears will have to guide you. 

As you noted - finding a lot of music with identical masters for the  comparison of MQA & CD is difficult (I know 2L and a few are out there just not that many genres ) but hopefully will become easier in time. 

Edited August 22, 2018 by frankn
Correction

[Guest Eggcup The Daft]

These have been around for a while. Stereophile covered them in 2017

https://www.stereophile.com/content/mqa-encoded-cds-yes

 

If your CD player outputs an upsampled signal to the MQA DAC apparently you won't get MQA playback, but otherwise it should all work as described.

[davewantsmoore]

50 minutes ago, frankn said:

MQA - a subject of much debate - yes.

Oh, sure    

 

 

Edited August 22, 2018 by davewantsmoore

[davewantsmoore]

51 minutes ago, frankn said:

music with identical masters

Indeed... once more people get hold of MQA encoders, there will be much more info ..... but I suspect they're trying to get all the big players committed while the debate is still ruled by the media.

 

 

MQA has the potential to be better (whether it's audible or not) than existing audio formats ..... but my true worry, is that MQA is mostly not about delivering everyone higher quality audio.

 

It's about rolling-out the capability to deliver 'artificially lower' quality audio to everyone who chooses not to use a MQA decoder (and dramatically so if they choose to be so bold).

 

 

 

The high end is where the hype is, but it's not where the $ and ears are ....  While only a very limited number of people (care at all, or) have equipment which can show the benefits of well a manicured playback path ..... most people will be able to tell (and will care) if their audio is reduced to AM radio quality (even through their expensive high quality equipment).

 

If we end up in a paradigm where unless you use an MQA decoder then it will sound very (artificially) bad .... then this is only some mild spin doctoring away from people forgetting that they made it that bad on purpose.

 

Quote

"I'm the best thing that ever happened to you....   Pay me money, and I'll stop punching you in the face"

 

[davewantsmoore]

27 minutes ago, Eggcup The Daft said:

If your CD player outputs an upsampled signal to the MQA DAC apparently you won't get MQA playback

Correct... but few CD players output oversampled rates from their digital outputs (yeah?) ... or at least can't be turned off.

[frankn]

 

If we end up in a paradigm where unless you use an MQA decoder then it will sound very (artificially) bad .... then this is only some mild spin doctoring away from people forgetting that they made it that bad on purpose.

 

@davewantsmoore - I agree, but I didn’t feel the need to post as it’s been ( and continues to be ) debated / discussed so many times in this forum and many others. 

[davewantsmoore]

2 minutes ago, frankn said:

the need

Don't worry!   You can count on me!      

[Guest Eggcup The Daft]

31 minutes ago, davewantsmoore said:

Correct... but few CD players output oversampled rates from their digital outputs (yeah?) ... or at least can't be turned off.

Various ones do. I don't know of any that can't be switched off, but I do know of some friends who got stuck trying to add an outboard DAC to a Chinese player of some sort a few years ago and eventually found it needed to be switched back to 1x, so it does happen.

[Anthony1]

MQA CD Chesky 2017 #MQA115
Bought one the recently from Caxton Audio in Brisbane.
Haven’t opened the wrapper, still reading up on the pros and cons of this new format.
Bought it so I could have another version of the reference song ‘Spanish Harlem’ and will compare to a SACD version and others.
They say in Redbook playback it should sound subtlety better.

I have a PSAudio CD/sacd and their top DAC.
For MQA I don’t have a CD transport to unfold or a DAC to render so it might be years (or never) before I hear it in full flight.

Even after researching components (Aug2018) I haven’t found a 1 box player (to unfold&render) or even a 2 box player from one manufacturer for straightforward MQA sound to my speakers.

Talk about cart before the horse with MQA.

[frankn]

@anthony1 you have the PS Audio DSD snr   -correct?

If you have also purchased a Bridge ll then if you rip the MQA file you can get MQA through the the bridge. 

This is the reply from the PS Audio forum to a similar question. 

 

[att23]

I would like to try and see if it is all it's cracked up to be...  in Asia, there are already so many different CD formats available:  SACD, Bluespec, XRCD, HQCD, Gold CD, LPCD, K2HD, UPM24k, Ultra HD, DXD, AQCD, ADMS, MQGCD...  This is a list from a Hong Kong audiophile music website that I frequently buy from.  

 

I have bought half of these formats,  and only 2 formats that impressed me enough that I am willing to spend more than $35 for an album.  In my system, SACD and UPM24k sounds better than the normal CD.  I don't understand why some audiophiles raved about other formats which I cannot hear any improvements in SQ.  Perhaps different source, cable or speakers will give different results on different formats?  Tbh, a nicely recorded/mastered conventional CD sounds extremely good already, but I have only ever come across a handful that was done that well, that I cannot hear the different between the CD and a SACD copies that I have.

 

Anyhow, another new one to try if I get a chance.  Although if that means I need to spend money on new DAC, decoder, or what not, it won't be happening anytime soon...

 

Edited August 23, 2018 by att23

[frankn]

2 hours ago, att23 said:

I would like to try and see if it is all it's cracked up to be....................

Anyhow, another new one to try if I get a chance.  Although if that means I need to spend money on new DAC, decoder, or what not, it won't be happening anytime soon...

 

@att23 - I agree, well recorded standard CD and also SACD sounds very good through a well designed DAC. 

If you want to try MQA you will need a DAC (or bridge) with licensed MQA software. If your DAC doesn’t have it (it costs the manufacturer) then you won’t “hear” it.  You can still play the disc (or file) but you won’t have the effect of the MQA filters applied. 

[davewantsmoore]

13 hours ago, Anthony1 said:

Even after researching components (Aug2018) I haven’t found a 1 box player (to unfold&render) or even a 2 box player from one manufacturer for straightforward MQA sound to my speakers.

I don't know of a one-box CD player which will ..... but any company which makes a normal CD player/transport (one with SPDIF output) and a standalone DAC which does MQA decoding (and has SPDIF input) will do this.

[Ian R-B]

15 hours ago, Anthony1 said:

Bought it so I could have another version of the reference song ‘Spanish Harlem’...

 

A favourite song of mine by the Mamas & Papas - if the same. Will have to check Rebecca out.

"Talk about cart before the horse with MQA".

 

Par for new format course : The man behind Sony's CD development (Norio Ohga) summed it all up from day one "Even if we have the hardware - it's useless without the software".

 

 

[Ian R-B]

11 hours ago, att23 said:

...  in Asia, there are already so many different CD formats available:  SACD, Bluespec, XRCD, HQCD, Gold CD, LPCD, K2HD, UPM24k, Ultra HD, DXD, AQCD, ADMS, MQGCD...  This is a list from a Hong Kong audiophile music website that I frequently buy from.  

Could you provide a link att23 thanks.

 

I was unaware of some of these formats on CD. I only own one DTS CD (24 bit) disc but another that did not survive ...

[cafe67]

Reminds me a bit of the HDCD , some players could decode, most couldnt. 

 

Some of the so encoded cd sounded really good 

 

 

[davewantsmoore]

16 hours ago, Anthony1 said:

Talk about cart before the horse with MQA.

It would be all part of the strategy.    Get as much content encoded with MQA as possible, to ensure that the gravity is strong.

 

Once their is enough gravity.... do "all the things" that modern technology allows (some pretty crazy good/bad things are possible).

 

 

[Stump]

Just ordered the 3X sample MQA CDs!Meanwhile I am waiting for a 78K Cryo'ed In England CD to try.If it is a improvement I will keep all my CDs in the Deep Freezer ..........

 

http://www.mshdpower.com/78k_eng.html

 

 

 

Edited August 24, 2018 by Stump