systemawarrior14 Posted February 17, 2019 Posted February 17, 2019 Hi fellow SNA members, I would like some clarification on the value of a capacitor for replacement on my Jamo D570. It is the tweeter cap at the top labelled 4.7k. I would like to replace them but am not sure of their value in uf. Any advice is appreciated. Best regards Darren.
Gieseler Audio Posted February 17, 2019 Posted February 17, 2019 Jantzen Superior would be a nice upgrade. https://speakerbug.com.au/index.php?route=product/product&path=25_31&product_id=199 3
systemawarrior14 Posted February 17, 2019 Author Posted February 17, 2019 11 minutes ago, Gieseler Audio said: Jantzen Superior would be a nice upgrade. https://speakerbug.com.au/index.php?route=product/product&path=25_31&product_id=199 13 minutes ago, mwhouston said: 4.7uf. Something to ponder.
Guest Muon N' Posted February 17, 2019 Posted February 17, 2019 Clay's suggestion of Jantzen Superior is a good, a musical cap in the affordable price range
systemawarrior14 Posted February 17, 2019 Author Posted February 17, 2019 2 hours ago, Gieseler Audio said: Jantzen Superior would be a nice upgrade. https://speakerbug.com.au/index.php?route=product/product&path=25_31&product_id=199 2 hours ago, mwhouston said: 4.7uf. Something to ponder. I have used Auricap before and really liked their neutrality and clean signal. What are the characteristics of a Jantzen cap?
Guest Muon N' Posted February 17, 2019 Posted February 17, 2019 (edited) @systemawarrior14 This site has a cap test with many players, and most folk find the descriptions he has on there to align with their own subjective experiences. Both caps you mention above are in there. http://www.humblehomemadehifi.com/Cap.html He has a few around to test it appears Edited February 17, 2019 by Muon N'
Guest Muon N' Posted February 17, 2019 Posted February 17, 2019 If strapped for cash, these are a discontinued cap from Obligatto also in that test. http://shop.diyhifisupply.com/product/4-7uf-630v-obbligato-euro-film-cap/ But it all depends on budget and what sound signature you feel might work well with the Jamos and considering you system sound as a whole..
Guest Muon N' Posted February 17, 2019 Posted February 17, 2019 @systemawarrior14 sorry, this is something you might also need to know, film caps normally have an inner foil end and an outer foil end, so installed one way they will reject interference (noise) more than if installed the other way. Here is someone testing for outer foil ends with a few different caps using an oscilloscope. http://www.jimmyauw.com/2010/04/24/observing-inner-and-outer-foil-of-some-popular-capacitors/
Cello Sweet. Posted February 19, 2019 Posted February 19, 2019 This looks like a cheap Jaycar cap possibly a metallised polyester or polyprop. The safesy bet is to measure it.A second order network on the tweeter is observable from the photo of the crossover . 4.7 uF is the most likely value together with the glued air core coil will be the two components of the 2nd order network ,no dropping resistor to the tweeter is evident though. The choice of cap should be undertaken to compliment the tweeters sonic signature . ie bright thin sounding tweeters eg some metal domes or hard domes should go with dark sounding cap like Mundorf supreme or Audience auricap, from my own experience over the years. Tweeters such as soft domes can handle a little more transparency from associated cap such as Jantzen Z silver (could border on bright)or copper. Agree with everybody's comments here. Even a basic solen mkp type will outperform your current cap. Also look at Intertechnik (Audyne caps) and Clarity Caps Csa high voltage series or film and foils ( metalised caps are not usually .directional) The Oblligatos premium are excellent for the money too. Audience Auricaps are smooth sounding but expensive for what you get. Dont forget that the capacitors we're talking about here may be more costly than the installed tweeter! Good luck. 1
systemawarrior14 Posted February 19, 2019 Author Posted February 19, 2019 Thanks Cello sweet. I had some old Solen .10 uf from an old Maggie 1.6 crossover and bypassed the tweeter caps on the Jamo . Well I can tell you the difference was immediately noticeable and for the better. This is what has convinced me to replace the entire cap. Thanks for your advice. Best regards Darren.
jojo320 Posted February 19, 2019 Posted February 19, 2019 (edited) On 17/02/2019 at 12:38 PM, Muon N' said: If strapped for cash, these are a discontinued cap from Obligatto also in that test. Xender Discord Omegle http://shop.diyhifisupply.com/product/4-7uf-630v-obbligato-euro-film-cap/ But it all depends on budget and what sound signature you feel might work well with the Jamos and considering you system sound as a whole.. musical cap in the affordable price range Edited February 19, 2019 by jojo320 1
systemawarrior14 Posted February 19, 2019 Author Posted February 19, 2019 Hi Jojo, I ordered some of the Obbligato on Monday. Thought it was worth a try at that price. I have a Yamaha AS1100 amp and Micromega mydac with the Jamo's. The overall sound is quite organic and the tonality of the Jamo's is very nice. There is a chance that the Obbligatos could overly ripen the sound, but if they do I'll just get some Auricaps.
Guest Muon N' Posted February 20, 2019 Posted February 20, 2019 (edited) I find Auri caps sound a tad synthetic to me, those black case Obligatto caps to my ears sound more real. See how it goes, let them run in for 50+ hours, I think you will like them. Edited February 20, 2019 by Muon N'
bob_m_54 Posted February 20, 2019 Posted February 20, 2019 Of course they're synthetic, you think they flamin grow on trees?
Guest Muon N' Posted February 20, 2019 Posted February 20, 2019 (edited) 46 minutes ago, bob_m_54 said: Of course they're synthetic, you think they flamin grow on trees? Bob, I said 'sound' as in subjectively sound that way, I was not referring to construction. But if intentionally misconstruing things gets you a giggle, that's cool Edited February 20, 2019 by Muon N' Oops, typo
Diego4 Posted March 19, 2020 Posted March 19, 2020 Hi there thanks for the advice.I have been wondering this issue!
raiffallen5854g Posted May 27, 2023 Posted May 27, 2023 On 19/03/2020 at 2:02 PM, Diego4 said: Hi there thanks for the advice.I have been wondering this issue! No Problem 1
Full Range Posted May 27, 2023 Posted May 27, 2023 Consider replacing the resistors as well They made a noticeable difference in my crossovers 1
andyr Posted May 27, 2023 Posted May 27, 2023 15 minutes ago, Full Range said: Consider replacing the resistors as well They made a noticeable difference in my crossovers ^ ^ ^ What the man said! 15 minutes ago, Full Range said: That is a serious XO - using high quality parts. But I'm wondering if you go to that extent ... why wouldn't you use differing orientations for the ribbon inductors, so as to minimise their interaction? 1
Full Range Posted May 27, 2023 Posted May 27, 2023 5 minutes ago, andyr said: ^ ^ ^ What the man said! That is a serious XO - using high quality parts. But I'm wondering if you go to that extent ... why wouldn't you use differing orientations for the ribbon inductors, so as to minimise their interaction? The crossovers are bigger than first appears in the photo We made sure no interaction was possible in the layout Size of the crossover board is 390mm X 470mm
andyr Posted May 27, 2023 Posted May 27, 2023 2 minutes ago, Full Range said: The crossovers are bigger than first appears in the photo Size of the crossover board is 390mm X 470mm Aah, OK. 2 minutes ago, Full Range said: We made sure no interaction was possible in the layout I'm curious to know how you "made sure no interaction was possible" between the inductors.
Full Range Posted May 27, 2023 Posted May 27, 2023 Just now, andyr said: I'm curious to know how you "made sure no interaction was possible" between the inductors. Nigel from Speaker bug built them for me and several upgrades as the build went on I found the thread where @davewantsmoore asked the same question https://www.stereonet.com/forums/topic/64191-3-way-eliptrac-horn-klipsch-la-scalas/page/3/#comments Nigels answer was and Quote Its good to see someone that actually pays attention and cares about such things. But any interaction should be minimal. the closest ones are ~12cm apart, and thats between the small mid and tweeter ones. These are going to be 'upgraded' to ones that should have less interaction than the current ones. what you can't really see from the pics is just how BIG these are. The plate is ~50 centimeters long, from terminals to the large inductor end. That black duelund resistor is 13cm long The large inductors are (from memory) 18cm apart. But if you really want to worry, those red caps have a aluminum 'shell' that if placed in the wrong spot also create issues. And then theres the attenuator transformers to consider with there iron cores. it was all carefully considered i assure you. yes there will probably be a little interaction, but i suspect it'll be so small as to be of no real consequence. After hearing and seeing the 'professionally' made original units, i can vouch for the news ones superiority... Maybe FR will put up pics of the ones he was using before these.
davewantsmoore Posted May 27, 2023 Posted May 27, 2023 (edited) 12cm is not necessarily "far". Measure it (what voltage is inductively coupled into the other) and you may be very surprised. There are youtube videos showing that 1v signal may couple 100mv in to an inductor 3 or 4 inches away, if it in the same plane. With the converse orientation, it can be as close as 1 inch and couple basically nothing. For a high senstivity transducer, 100mv is very significant.... the coupling (and it's effect) will depend on frequency and power though. 1 hour ago, Full Range said: red caps have a aluminum 'shell' that if placed in the wrong spot also create issues. Not the same issue, right?! The metal component will affect the strength of the inductor (like an "iron core" does, for example) .... but another inductor can couple the actual signal into the victim inductor. EDIT - the internet is full of discussions, etc.... looking at the issue from the perspective of "what is the indictance value" when inductors are near each other..... this can be worked around (measure them in place) but is missing the major issue (crosstalk of signals). Edited May 27, 2023 by davewantsmoore 3
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