Innuos Owners and Discussions Thread

[AussieMick]

Hi All

  the Telos Macro Q arrived today. I sat down for half an hour of serious listening before plugging it in in place of an Akiko Audio USB stick in the back up port of the Zen MK3. 
Really quite a big change. Acoustic space, stage height and depth, texture. Not subtle at all. This feels like tremendous value for money as an upgrade. I’ll happily recommend it to anyone.

Mick
 

[Silver Audiophile]

4 hours ago, AussieMick said:

Hi All

  the Telos Macro Q arrived today. I sat down for half an hour of serious listening before plugging it in in place of an Akiko Audio USB stick in the back up port of the Zen MK3. 
Really quite a big change. Acoustic space, stage height and depth, texture. Not subtle at all. This feels like tremendous value for money as an upgrade. I’ll happily recommend it to anyone.

Mick
 

You nailed it Mick.. It creates massive amounts of space and layering detail. Night and day, notice it within a few seconds of listening. For 400 bucks.. amazing value.

Since I own the other Telos Audio products, let me tell you exactly the same thing applies to all the Telos products I've tried!

But, if I was to rank, the biggest difference in order from most significant to least- Telos Quantum X2 fuses, then the Telos Caps, the Telos Macro Q, then Telos Macro G!

Telos Quantum X2 fuses worked best in the pre amp, PS Audio P10 power regenerator, DAC, and Innuous Streamer.

 

Telos Quantum X2 fuse - Mind blowing improvement! Soundstage doubles again, and vocal and instrument visceral fill. Cheap $120 upgrade.

 

Telos Caps - Detail, detail, detail. The more open ports you cap off (at the back of your equipment), the more veil is lifted. The veil is noise floor disappearing. Details comes, without loss of mid range warmth or body. $70 per four RCA caps..

 

Telos Macro G - More realistic body to mid range. More expensive around $1,300. Not as much bang for buck, but, can't listen to my system now when it is turned off.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 27, 2022 by Silver Audiophile

[AussieMick]

I’m in agreement about the X2. I preferred it a great deal over the SR Orange, so for me the value is high. Telos XLR and BNC caps adorn the back of all my gear and the difference is a much more focused sound with less edge.

[Silver Audiophile]

On 23/06/2022 at 11:18 AM, lebowski said:

Has anyone gone from a Node 2i to an Innuos Zen Mini or Zen and how much better do the Innuos sound?

 

 

Yes. I took my Innuos Zen Mk3 over to my friends place to compare with Node 2i. We both immediately heard the difference. Node 2i was noticeably lacking in detail, and imaging. It also sounded more 'closed in', and vocal had less density.

 

 

 

 

 

[rantan]

17 minutes ago, Silver Audiophile said:

 

Yes. I took my Innuos Zen Mk3 over to my friends place to compare with Node 2i. We both immediately heard the difference. Node 2i was noticeably lacking in detail, and imaging. It also sounded more 'closed in', and vocal had less density.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Good to know. and as it certainly should be at 2.5 times the price.

I am toying with the idea of streaming but I want something as good as my CD,without spending $3K+ and the Mini MK3 is first in my thoughts so far.

[Silver Audiophile]

1 hour ago, rantan said:

 

Good to know. and as it certainly should be at 2.5 times the price.

I am toying with the idea of streaming but I want something as good as my CD,without spending $3K+ and the Mini MK3 is first in my thoughts so far.

 

Thing with my Innuos Zen Mk3, I have compared it A/B with CD players I did own and others I have borrowed. The last example I loaned for 2 weeks a Audionet Art G3 CD player from a friend. German made, and weighs 22Kg. Retail is approx. 7,000 Euros.

The Innuos Zen Mk3 absolutely put to shame Audio Net Art G3 CD player. Comparison was done with a CD in the Audio Net CD player Vs that same CD being ripped into the Innuos Zen's HD memory. The Audio Net sound very bright and thin, digital. A rather unpleasant experience. I found the similar experience with my Musical Fidelity A5 and M6 CD players, both bright and thin, fragile sounding. Hence, I've sold them all off.

 

Below: The Audio Net Art G3 CD player.

 

 

 

[rantan]

7 minutes ago, Silver Audiophile said:

Thing with my Innuos Zen Mk3, I have compared it A/B with CD players I did own and others I have borrowed. The last example I loaned for 2 weeks a Audionet Art G3 CD player from a friend. German made, and weighs 22Kg. Retail is approx. 7,000 Euros.

The Innuos Zen Mk3 absolutely put to shame Audio Net Art G3 CD player. Comparison was done with a CD in the Audio Net CD player Vs that same CD being ripped into the Innuos Zen's HD memory. The Audio Net sound very bright and thin, digital. A rather unpleasant experience. I found the similar experience with my Musical Fidelity A5 and M6 CD players, both bright and thin, fragile sounding. Hence, I've sold them all off.

 

 

I have absolutely no doubt you are correct, but although I have heard the Zen Mini and (obviously ) my Electrocompaniet EMC 1 ) I have not heard them side by side . However based on numerous auditions and sessions listening to the Zen Mini, I would still say my EC is superior. It is the antithesis of those characteristics you mentioned above in the other players and this is my "problem"

Strictly speaking I only require a streamer/dac with WiFi capability so I am waiting for the new Pulse range.

[AussieMick]

Yes, the Pulse Mini I dare say will be a corker. All they’ve learned from the Zen series, without the complication of a ripper and storage. 
In the main system at home the Zen MK3 runs into a Chord TT2. When the Pulse Mini is available I’ll have one next to my bed, feeding a Mojo 2. I will be very bloody happy. 

[AussieMick]

Further on fuses…

 

QSA Yellow has made a splash in the Zen MK3. I like it more than both the X2 and Orange. There’s a Violet on the way that was special order, but if it’s truly better than the Yellow then I’ll be incredibly happy. 

[Silver Audiophile]

39 minutes ago, AussieMick said:

Further on fuses…

 

QSA Yellow has made a splash in the Zen MK3. I like it more than both the X2 and Orange. There’s a Violet on the way that was special order, but if it’s truly better than the Yellow then I’ll be incredibly happy. 

 

I have never tried the QSA yellow fuse, but, I take accept your observations verses the Telos Quantum X2 and SR Orange. The Telos Quantum X2 is $120, so not a huge amount of cash for a noticeable leap in performance.

However, nearly fell off my chair once I saw the AUD prices of QSA fuses...

 

There are seven levels available:

Light Blue at $110

Yellow at $309

Violet at $1,090

Red at $2,050

Red Black at $4.090

Silver at $7,150

Gold at $14,300

 

https://absolutehiend.com/product/qsa-quantum-science-audio-audiophile-fuses-australia/

 

QSA – Quantum Science Audio Audiophile Fuses

Quantum Sciences has been working on research and development of their fuses for over 22 years. Their proprietary technology removes what they call “bottle neck distortion”, making the sound reproduced by your components more alive, unbelievably dynamic with an ultra dark sonic background. Enjoy the musical experience in your home like never before!

The fuse is one of the biggest bottlenecks in any audio component performance. At QSA, their belief is that the biggest bottleneck in an audio components’ performance is the fuse. All of the power feeding your component (probably from a very expensive power cord) ultimately runs through this tiny filament of wire -a ten cent part- before it enters your system. Power cords can and do help, as does power conditioning, but ultimately it is the fuse that is the weak link in the power chain. QSA has spent 22 years working to eliminate this bottleneck. Their line of fuses spans a wide range of performance levels and price points. All are designed to eliminate the distortions created by a typical fuse. The end result are fuses that allow your components to perform at their best. Drawing you into the music on an emotional level you might not have thought possible. QSA’s value proposition and challenge to the customer is that these fuses will outperform the sonic benefits power cords and cables costing many times more.

 

 

 

[AussieMick]

12 minutes ago, Silver Audiophile said:

 

I have never tried the QSA yellow fuse, but, I take accept your observations verses the Telos Quantum X2 and SR Orange. The Telos Quantum X2 is $120, so not a huge amount of cash for a noticeable leap in performance.

However, nearly fell off my chair once I saw the AUD prices of QSA fuses...

 

There are seven levels available:

Light Blue at $110

Yellow at $309

Violet at $1,090

Red at $2,050

Red Black at $4.090

Silver at $7,150

Gold at $14,300

 

https://absolutehiend.com/product/qsa-quantum-science-audio-audiophile-fuses-australia/

 

QSA – Quantum Science Audio Audiophile Fuses

Quantum Sciences has been working on research and development of their fuses for over 22 years. Their proprietary technology removes what they call “bottle neck distortion”, making the sound reproduced by your components more alive, unbelievably dynamic with an ultra dark sonic background. Enjoy the musical experience in your home like never before!

The fuse is one of the biggest bottlenecks in any audio component performance. At QSA, their belief is that the biggest bottleneck in an audio components’ performance is the fuse. All of the power feeding your component (probably from a very expensive power cord) ultimately runs through this tiny filament of wire -a ten cent part- before it enters your system. Power cords can and do help, as does power conditioning, but ultimately it is the fuse that is the weak link in the power chain. QSA has spent 22 years working to eliminate this bottleneck. Their line of fuses spans a wide range of performance levels and price points. All are designed to eliminate the distortions created by a typical fuse. The end result are fuses that allow your components to perform at their best. Drawing you into the music on an emotional level you might not have thought possible. QSA’s value proposition and challenge to the customer is that these fuses will outperform the sonic benefits power cords and cables costing many times more.

 

 

 

Well…

I’m still getting my head around the value of an aftermarket fuse. The Telos X2 at $120 is remarkable value. Where else can you spend $120 to improve your system that much? Certainly not supports or cables. I genuinely can’t think of anything at that price giving the same improvement, hence me thinking the value is off the charts good. And for me, VALUE is the number one factor in deciding where my money goes. 
So I asked the same question of the SR Orange. While still excellent value in ge real, I thought it less so than the X2. Moving onto the QSA Yellow was just as big a “wow” experience compared to the X2 as the X2 was to the stock fuse. It came to me via a friend for $240. Again, I’ve never heard a tweak at $240 to get anywhere near it. 
But now I’m entering a different price bracket altogether, purchasing a QSA Violet. It costs more than my second favourite value for money tweak, the Telos Macro Q USB. When the Violet arrives I’ll have a very real comparison. It will need to bring greater improvement than the Macro Q in order to still be called high value. 
However, I’ll also be able to swap out a similarly priced Cardas Clear Light interconnect for a giveaway cable. Which will make the bigger difference over the stock item? 
Time for a value judgement!

[eostre23]

This may seem a basic question but where are these QSA fuses place in the chain?

[Silver Audiophile]

5 hours ago, AussieMick said:

Well…

I’m still getting my head around the value of an aftermarket fuse. The Telos X2 at $120 is remarkable value. Where else can you spend $120 to improve your system that much? Certainly not supports or cables. I genuinely can’t think of anything at that price giving the same improvement, hence me thinking the value is off the charts good. And for me, VALUE is the number one factor in deciding where my money goes. 
So I asked the same question of the SR Orange. While still excellent value in ge real, I thought it less so than the X2. Moving onto the QSA Yellow was just as big a “wow” experience compared to the X2 as the X2 was to the stock fuse. It came to me via a friend for $240. Again, I’ve never heard a tweak at $240 to get anywhere near it. 
But now I’m entering a different price bracket altogether, purchasing a QSA Violet. It costs more than my second favourite value for money tweak, the Telos Macro Q USB. When the Violet arrives I’ll have a very real comparison. It will need to bring greater improvement than the Macro Q in order to still be called high value. 
However, I’ll also be able to swap out a similarly priced Cardas Clear Light interconnect for a giveaway cable. Which will make the bigger difference over the stock item? 
Time for a value judgement!

Also, bare in mind, fuses are disposable items, meant to blow when there is a powersurge. I blew two Quantum fuses in my Primaluna pre amp. Ouch, $120 each time blown.

But, speaking with Peter from Groove works (Telos Audio importer), he rarely heard of this happening. I've only had issues of fuses blowing in my Primaluna pre amp, and no other item.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 29, 2022 by Silver Audiophile

[Niktech]

On 27/6/2022 at 1:33 PM, AussieMick said:

Hi All

  the Telos Macro Q arrived today. I sat down for half an hour of serious listening before plugging it in in place of an Akiko Audio USB stick in the back up port of the Zen MK3. 
Really quite a big change. Acoustic space, stage height and depth, texture. Not subtle at all. This feels like tremendous value for money as an upgrade. I’ll happily recommend it to anyone.

Mick
 

I’ve had the Macro Q for a about 6 months and it is a definite improvement.  Within seconds the noise floor drops significantly. and the depth of bass and it’s impact is extended. 
 

on my audio pc I convert other devices input connections, such as hdmi for the monitor to a USB connection just so any potential noise is cleaned up by the Telos.
 

Some reviewers online suggested that if you found the impact of The Telos Macro Q directly inserted into your device, not to your liking, - too bright etc-  then it can be tuned down somewhat by using the supplied extension dongle. YMMV, but I didn’t notice this. 
 

As an aside, all unused ports  on my devices have EGM caps.

[Hydrology]

7 hours ago, eostre23 said:

This may seem a basic question but where are these QSA fuses place in the chain?

 

Round the back of the Innuos where the power socket is, fuse holder is just below.

[rantan]

 

I discovered only yesterday that none of the upcoming Pulse series  have an on board dac. Unfortunately this is a definite deal breaker for me.

I understand why they are doing this, but sadly, I won't be a starter which is really disappointing.

 

Edit: typos

Edited June 30, 2022 by rantan

[Neo]

For me the qsa fuse wow moment was when I replaced the stock one on the Rega Apollo with qsa light blue. Going from Telos x2 to qsa yellow was less dramatic difference at lease to my ears in my headphone amplifier. Will look into the qsa yellow at some stage for the Rega Apollo as I discovered CD medium again.

Neo

Edited June 30, 2022 by Neo

[maximus]

@rantanI discovered only yesterday that none of the upcoming Pulse series  have an on board dac. 

 

Unfortunately streamer only rantan. I too got discouraged when I found out, that's why I went with a rival. It might be best if you could find an SA Innous retailer and try it with one of their very cheap dacs they have in store, audition and cost exercise.

 

Frank.    

[AussieMick]

58 minutes ago, rantan said:

 

I discovered only yesterday that none of the upcoming Pulse series  have an on board dac. Unfortunately this is a definite deal breaker for me.

I understand why they are doing this, but sadly, I won't be a starter which is really disappointing.

 

Edit: typos

Yep, Innuos are all aboard the sound quality first train. Adding a DAC would not only add expense, but a great deal more internal noise to deal with. Have a listen to Darko’s podcast with Nuno and he talks about why there’s a DAC in the Zen Mini but nothing else. 
 

https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/darko-audio-podcast/id1368388920?i=1000429854960

 

Streamers that compete with the Innuos models and include a worthwhile DAC are pricey. A Pulse Mini for me will be used as an endpoint for the Zen in my main system. Mojo 2 and LCDi4 at the end of it. 
 

Is there a push from people to have a seperate DAC because they’re worried about obsolescence?

[rantan]

15 minutes ago, maximus said:

@rantanI discovered only yesterday that none of the upcoming Pulse series  have an on board dac. 

 

Unfortunately streamer only rantan. I too got discouraged when I found out, that's why I went with a rival. It might be best if you could find an SA Innous retailer and try it with one of their very cheap dacs they have in store, audition and cost exercise.

 

Frank.    

 

Hi Frank.

Thank you for the suggestion,it is appreciated.

 

The real problem that I have is the need to reduce box count and make the addition of streaming capability straightforward in my system. I am presently doing some research  on a work around for the Zen Mini to connect via several means but it would just be really nice to buy a ready-to-go,high quality stand alone streamer. Essentially I am looking for something conceptually like the Bluesound Node N130 with significantly better sound quality, without breaking the bank.

 

Edit: I should also point out that my situation is such that WiFi connection capability is virtually essential, but as I referred to above, there are some work around methods of achieving this so if one of these methods are successful I may still be able to incorporate a Zen Mini.

I won't be giving up on my cds or my player so the ripping and storing facility will be there if/when I want to use it.

Edited June 30, 2022 by rantan

[maximus]

13 minutes ago, rantan said:

 

Hi Frank.

Thank you for the suggestion,it is appreciated.

 

The real problem that I have is the need to reduce box count and make the addition of streaming capability straightforward in my system. I am presently doing some research  on a work around for the Zen Mini to connect via several means but it would just be really nice to buy a ready-to-go,high quality stand alone streamer. Essentially I am looking for something conceptually like the Bluesound Node N130 with significantly better sound quality, without breaking the bank.

Yes, you'd have to  spend double to achieve considerable improvement  in a one box solution. They are out there in the 3k band, but for the sake of being chastised I'll keep a low profile on it. @blakey72has something that would fit the bill, he seems to be impressed with the product. 

[Neo]

Considering dacs always improve new chips, models etc, it’s better to have them separate from the streamer. Also realistically inexpensive to upgrade either unit in the long run if a better model arrives. More flexibility this way to mix and match as not every manufacturer has a lineup of models and features in their gear. 

Neo

Edited June 30, 2022 by Neo

[AussieMick]

True, but how often does a truly revolutionary DAC come along? Some older ones still represent excellent value, like the original Mojo. These DACs don’t “get worse”, they just get superseded by incrementally better ones. Ten years, sure. I wonder if a $3500 streaming DAC will sound competitive in five years. Probably will, right? Ten years? Probably not. But how much will it cost to buy the equivalent sound quality after ten years? Half? And what will $3500 buy you after five or ten years? 
If you’re happy with the product, what makes you want to change? Upgrade bug? Just wondering what’s out there? It seems like the fear of not having the latest and greatest becomes the biggest problem. If you love the upgrades and tweaks as a part of the fun then seperate boxes seem the way to go. If you want to just listen happily with minimal box count…

[Silver Audiophile]

3 hours ago, AussieMick said:

True, but how often does a truly revolutionary DAC come along? Some older ones still represent excellent value, like the original Mojo. These DACs don’t “get worse”, they just get superseded by incrementally better ones. Ten years, sure. I wonder if a $3500 streaming DAC will sound competitive in five years. Probably will, right? Ten years? Probably not. But how much will it cost to buy the equivalent sound quality after ten years? Half? And what will $3500 buy you after five or ten years? 
If you’re happy with the product, what makes you want to change? Upgrade bug? Just wondering what’s out there? It seems like the fear of not having the latest and greatest becomes the biggest problem. If you love the upgrades and tweaks as a part of the fun then seperate boxes seem the way to go. If you want to just listen happily with minimal box count…

I couldn't agree more. A good DAC, like all high end components in the HiFi chain still requires a good power supply, and design. The latest this or that 'chip' is for consumer grade DACs. High end DACs are increasingly going for R2R resistor ladder architecture, which is a hard wired old fashioned circuit design, not a single or dual latest chip. Below is example of one fine sounding DAC I own, a Musical Fidelity Tri-Vista 300 DAC. It has a beefy dual toroidal transformer, dual over sized chokes, large bank of caps, miniture tubes in the output stage, and weighs 13kg. Most of the cost here is power supply, frame, and the shear number of parts. I've heard it against 2kg flimsy latest DACs costing $200-4000, with the 'latest chip'. The Tri-Vista DAC walks all over them.

 

 

A 20 year old DAC, with all power supply goodies. Used price about $1,000.

 

 

 

Verses, a $4,000 newer DAC with Mr Flimsy cheap construction and 'latest chip'. Have a guess which sounds better?

 

 

 

 

[AussieMick]

Power supplies, input and output stages.  

I'm an unabashed Chord fanboy. Mojo is 2016. TT2 is 2018. Both still magnificent. And when fed with a quality data stream from the Zen…

Edited June 30, 2022 by AussieMick