nothing1 Posted May 15, 2023 Posted May 15, 2023 When will the Ares II get updated firmware? why Pontus first when Ares ii was originally first? Thanks
david.aj.silva Posted May 15, 2023 Posted May 15, 2023 I might be mistaken, but I believe the Ares firmware has been updated. Did you check the fw doenload folder. I don't have access yet to check. 1
nothing1 Posted May 15, 2023 Posted May 15, 2023 it got the update that fixed the few issues it had like phase and buffer settings and added the new DSP settings but people where not to happy with the new sound! Denafrips said that they would bring out a firmware that fixed the issues but left the sound signature alone this is the firmware i am asking about as it seems pontus may have got that update before the AresII 2
GregWormald Posted May 16, 2023 Posted May 16, 2023 (edited) 11 hours ago, nothing1 said: it got the update that fixed the few issues it had like phase and buffer settings and added the new DSP settings but people where not to happy with the new sound! Denafrips said that they would bring out a firmware that fixed the issues but left the sound signature alone this is the firmware i am asking about it seems pontus may have got that update before the AresII. My understanding is that the Pontus and Pontus II original upgrades were actually based on the Pontus 12th anniversary model and that the changes from the II to the 12 hardware made it not the fit that they had hoped for. The new upgrade was made specifically for the original Pontus models, and the Ares models were made for them not the Ares 12. Edited May 16, 2023 by GregWormald corrections 2 1
thimmy118 Posted May 16, 2023 Posted May 16, 2023 43 minutes ago, GregWormald said: My understanding is that the Pontus and Pontus II original upgrades were actually based on the Pontus 12th anniversary model and that the changes from the II to the 12 hardware made it not the fit that they had hoped for. The new upgrade was made specifically for the original Pontus models, and the Ares models were made for them as there is no Ares 12. I gather as much too when I saw the recent clip on Youtube. However, unless there is a change to the FPGA chip, there appears to be only minor differences between the two from my superficial point of view. Other than the 12th Anniv. software, hardware differences include true NOS R-2R DAC, enhanced & fine tuned power supply and gold-plated screws & conductors for power transfer from PSU to the DAC module. Perhaps the changes to power supply and NOS programming may have had the biggest influence on the sound and hence fitting the 12th anniversary firmware to previous Pontus models with slightly different parts is akin to putting a turbo charge engine management system software to a natural aspirated car of the same model; some parts may work while others may still work but not as efficiently as one would hope.
krebetman Posted May 16, 2023 Posted May 16, 2023 Listening to a couple of tracks over lunch on my EP4CE22 Pontus, I can report that with firmware 1.4, the bass is most definitely back! Trying to adjust back, but time will tell if it is possible that in my system, I might prefer the (older) 3.3 version from March might suit me better. My ears need to do more breaking in! 1
GregWormald Posted May 16, 2023 Posted May 16, 2023 Updated my Pontus II with version 1.4 just now and set it running—sounds good. Whether it will be better than the previous update I'll have to wait and see. I'm not much for concentrating on the 'sound' for short term tests as it takes away from my focus on enjoying the music. Vinshine said the last update had to burn in for a few hours at least so maybe this is the same. Anyway, long term listening may tell, but IMO it's a great DAC anyway. 2
nothing1 Posted May 16, 2023 Posted May 16, 2023 it's just i remember Alvin saying there would be the best of both worlds(regarding the fixing of the issues and keeping the old sound) early on in the piece before the pontus got updated these were the issues as stated by Denafrips * Improved Adaptive FIFO Buffer & Reclocking Architecture * Reduced the effect of Buffer overrun/underrun due to the Source's Clock and the DAC's Clock differences * Eliminate Phase Difference between L/R Channels * Optimised DSP to improve the sonic performance - WITHOUT THIS Thanks Also on some of the Ares II they had a display rate bug ( files showing as playing at DSD2048 instead of DSD1024, this was fixed with a specialized firmware that i no longer have when i rolled back to version 1 i also rolled back to the display issue glitch the Ares II needs a firmware that fixes/improves * Improved Adaptive FIFO Buffer & Reclocking Architecture * Reduced the effect of Buffer overrun/underrun due to the Source's Clock and the DAC's Clock differences * Eliminate Phase Difference between L/R Channels and just because people did not like the new sound(that they never asked for or wanted) shouldn't mean that they have to miss out on the improvements others got. I love Denafrips and i am just trying to clarify that the Ares II owners that did not like the new sound will be getting the new improved(best of both worlds) firmware? Alvin, Denafrips.
GregWormald Posted May 18, 2023 Posted May 18, 2023 On 16/05/2023 at 5:15 PM, nothing1 said: it's just i remember Alvin saying there would be the best of both worlds(regarding the fixing of the issues and keeping the old sound) early on in the piece before the pontus got updated these were the issues as stated by Denafrips * Improved Adaptive FIFO Buffer & Reclocking Architecture * Reduced the effect of Buffer overrun/underrun due to the Source's Clock and the DAC's Clock differences * Eliminate Phase Difference between L/R Channels * Optimised DSP to improve the sonic performance - WITHOUT THIS Thanks Also on some of the Ares II they had a display rate bug ( files showing as playing at DSD2048 instead of DSD1024, this was fixed with a specialized firmware that i no longer have when i rolled back to version 1 i also rolled back to the display issue glitch the Ares II needs a firmware that fixes/improves * Improved Adaptive FIFO Buffer & Reclocking Architecture * Reduced the effect of Buffer overrun/underrun due to the Source's Clock and the DAC's Clock differences * Eliminate Phase Difference between L/R Channels and just because people did not like the new sound(that they never asked for or wanted) shouldn't mean that they have to miss out on the improvements others got. I love Denafrips and i am just trying to clarify that the Ares II owners that did not like the new sound will be getting the new improved(best of both worlds) firmware? Alvin, Denafrips. You are making the assumption that all the changes minus one won't affect the sound. I'm not sure this would be true—maybe ask Vinshine and Denafrips themselves.
nothing1 Posted May 18, 2023 Posted May 18, 2023 1 hour ago, GregWormald said: You are making the assumption that all the changes minus one won't affect the sound. I'm not sure this would be true—maybe ask Vinshine and Denafrips themselves. Of course the other changes will have an effect on the sound, phase and buffering will obviously have an effect but not in the same way as the dsp which changed the whole sound characteristics, we won’t know for sure until they release the new version.
Niktech Posted May 18, 2023 Posted May 18, 2023 LOL the firmware merry-go-round. Reminds me of some users endless pursuit of what’s the best filter and modulator in HQPlayer - there is no right answer there. 1
krebetman Posted May 19, 2023 Posted May 19, 2023 (edited) On 18/05/2023 at 7:55 PM, Niktech said: there is no right answer there. Indeed and very system dependant I suspect. For my part (not a Pontus 12th, but an earlier Pontus II), 3.3 reads as lean and fast with really textured base that slammed but emphasised the mid-bass less. By contrast 1.4 brings back the "phat" aspect to the bass that slaps more, I am still trying to work out if the real bass depth has change at all though. 1.4 is more for the heart (IMO) and 3.3 more for the head. IMO both newer versions are (far) superior to the original PII firmware. For example, my wife and I had a bit of a Red Hot Chili Peppers afternoon just before I upgraded from 3.3 to 1.4. We were dancing around to the tight, full beat that was so infectious. After installing 1.4 I played a couple of the same tracks (but quieter) and had to seriously readjust to the greater percieved mid-bass, but at the same time the performance was projected right out in the room that it sounded more live and vivid. Which I enjoy more, I still don't know! Edited May 23, 2023 by krebetman Can't type to save myself 3
GregWormald Posted June 5, 2023 Posted June 5, 2023 (edited) The 1.4 version of the Pontus II has been going for a few weeks now and my verdict is YES. I try to pay little attention to analysing the sound but focus on my behaviour. IMO there is no great change in the sound, but...I'm playing more music and have found it harder to let it sit in the background. I more often get distracted by what's playing and stop whatever else I'm doing, close my eyes and get lost in the music. It's staying. Edited June 5, 2023 by GregWormald spelling 5
krebetman Posted June 5, 2023 Posted June 5, 2023 I wonder how the Terminator owners are going with their newly minted update?
08Boss302 Posted June 5, 2023 Posted June 5, 2023 54 minutes ago, GregWormald said: The 1.4 version of the Pontus II has been going for a few weeks now and my verdict is YES. I try to pay little attention to analysing the sound but focus on my behaviour. IMO there is no great change in the sound, but...I'm playing more music and have found it harder to let it sit in the background. I more often get distracted by what's playing and stop whatever else I'm doing, close my eyes and get lost in the music. It's staying. Similar experience for me and the Ares II. Ill be sticking with the update. 1
Niktech Posted June 5, 2023 Posted June 5, 2023 All these firmware updates, reversals and fixups just seems to be a mess going by the Facebook forum posts as users try to determine what’s the beat firmware. I’m happily enjoying the organic sound of the original firmware
GregWormald Posted June 5, 2023 Posted June 5, 2023 2 hours ago, Niktech said: All these firmware updates, reversals and fixups just seems to be a mess going by the Facebook forum posts as users try to determine what’s the beat firmware. Given individual preferences, and the focus on short-term testing of the sound rather than longer-term musical enjoyment, I'm not surprised. I gave that sort of testing/evaluation the boot more than a couple of decades ago. 1
Beacon Posted June 15, 2023 Posted June 15, 2023 My main concern with the firmware updates is that the process is anything but simple and seems to be windows based. As a Mac user I'm not sure I want to take the chance of bricking the DAC if something goes wrong and given the number of issues reported here and elsewhere I think I'll just stick with the firmware supplied on my TII and Hermes as they sound great together and I'm used to that sound. And I guess that is really what it's all about. At best I would imagine that any firmware update would provide very minimal improvement in SQ but, of course, I could be wrong!
GregWormald Posted June 15, 2023 Posted June 15, 2023 While the upgrade via a Mac is not exactly simple, the instructions are complete and straight-forward. Just read each step before doing it () and then do it. I've done it twice with no issues. Of course if you prefer the original firmware to the upgrade, then it wasn't an upgrade for you and you'll have to go through the process twice as well. p.s. Do let the new pathways through the chip burn in before evaluating. 1
krebetman Posted June 15, 2023 Posted June 15, 2023 12 minutes ago, Beacon said: My main concern with the firmware updates is that the process is anything but simple and seems to be windows based. As a Mac user I'm not sure I want to take the chance of bricking the DAC if something goes wrong and given the number of issues reported here and elsewhere I think I'll just stick with the firmware supplied on my TII and Hermes as they sound great together and I'm used to that sound. And I guess that is really what it's all about. At best I would imagine that any firmware update would provide very minimal improvement in SQ but, of course, I could be wrong! I can verify that it is possible (and actually pretty simple) to do updates from Macs (having done USB MCU updates for my Pontus and Iris multiple times, as well as gone back and forth on the FPGA updates for the Pontus). If you are scared, I am happy to help you through the process. 1
Beacon Posted June 15, 2023 Posted June 15, 2023 Thanks for that, much appreciated. I have visited the download site several times and as I said the process looked like it was fraught with likely pitfalls. You have allayed my concerns somewhat, however, if you stuff it up then the DAC has to be sent to the Au distributor for a fix. This is not a simple exercise with the T2 as it comes in a huge box and weighs 20+kg! I'm OK with computers having worked as a network admin with both Macs and PCs so my confidence level is up there it's just that I don't fully trust the process as it currently stands. For example, last time I looked, the FW upgrade involves downloading 2 pieces of SW which have to work together and that's where I stopped simply because there were too many likely problems that I could foresee. Maybe this has now changed. I'm a great believer in the old adage that if something isn't broken then you shouldn't try to fix it!!! This is the case with my current setup. It sounds great to me and with the Hermes DDC has moved to another level. The only problem that I have encountered recently concerns clock synchronisation BNC cables which sometimes fail to make a positive connection with either DAC or DDC.... but that is another topic.... (Would gladly hear from others with this problem) Anyway, many thanks again for offer of assistance and if I do decide to give it another go I'll be in touch.
GregWormald Posted June 15, 2023 Posted June 15, 2023 1 hour ago, Beacon said: last time I looked, the FW upgrade involves downloading 2 pieces of SW which have to work together and that's where I stopped simply because there were too many likely problems that I could foresee. The two softwares for the Pontus II were the "tool" and the upgrade itself. You just run the tool and point it to the particular software you want to install.
Crakers Posted June 15, 2023 Posted June 15, 2023 (edited) I'm no computer genius but found it very easy to complete the 2 updates with a Mac to my pontus 2 , just take your time and follow the instructions Edited June 15, 2023 by Crakers
Beacon Posted June 15, 2023 Posted June 15, 2023 Cheers guys, greatly appreciate the ready help and feedback.... Anyone experiencing connection issues with BNC clock cables between DAC and DDC? I've now had 2 sets of custom made BNC cables which do not securely connect. Got a refund on the first set and a bit of a jiggle fixes the problem with the second set but it's still annoying. Thinking of trying RCA terminated coaxial cables with BNC adapters. It is possible to not use clock sync but that does affect the SQ at least with I2S. With clock sync turned on, on both DAC and DDC, the SQ is glorious.... Huge soundstage, deep, deep bass, superb mids and crystal clear highs... I've never heard my system sound so good, hence my reluctance to fiddle with FW!!!! Cheers all... 2
Willmax Posted June 15, 2023 Posted June 15, 2023 1 hour ago, Beacon said: Cheers guys, greatly appreciate the ready help and feedback.... Anyone experiencing connection issues with BNC clock cables between DAC and DDC? I've now had 2 sets of custom made BNC cables which do not securely connect. Got a refund on the first set and a bit of a jiggle fixes the problem with the second set but it's still annoying. Thinking of trying RCA terminated coaxial cables with BNC adapters. It is possible to not use clock sync but that does affect the SQ at least with I2S. With clock sync turned on, on both DAC and DDC, the SQ is glorious.... Huge soundstage, deep, deep bass, superb mids and crystal clear highs... I've never heard my system sound so good, hence my reluctance to fiddle with FW!!!! Cheers all... @Superfuzzbigmuff was experimenting with different cables for his DDC, he may be able to chime in.
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