Roon instability

[A J]

Hi Team SNA

I've been using Roon ROCK for ages - rock solid no issues. Just today I cannot get something to play >60Secs - very unusual. I've tried all the usual stuff, rebooted router, rebooted ROON, reinstalled ROON, nothing makes a difference. Before I tear my non -existent hair out can I have a sense check that everyone else is fine??

 

Regards

AJ

[A J]

It basically loses the core then finds it again - but the music is paused

[A J]

Software 1.8 build 918

[awayward]

Do you Roon backup?

I’ve had weird stuff happening  and a restore from backup fix it, just a thought!

[Godot]

Delete Roon remote, then reinstall/reload it? This has worked for me with upgrades to server and Roon software resulting in Roon remote not finding core. After downloading a fresh Roon remote that issue has been solved for me. 

[mmv]

Usually I've and that sort of problem when there are network/connectivity issues. 

 

They usually make no sense I do agree! 

[frednork]

Have you added to your library recently?

[Demondes]

2 hours ago, mmv said:

Usually I've and that sort of problem when there are network/connectivity issues. 

 

They usually make no sense I do agree! 

Yeah I would be looking at a network issue first, it may not be this but worth a check

are you using any wifi or all Ethernet to the Roon rock.  Where is the music stored on the Roon rock itself or separate NAS?

 

Alternatively can you rollback to a previous Roon version if you think it is only with the latest version that instability appeared?

 

 

 

 

 

[A J]

It's an interesting problem. I run Roon ROCK on a NUC, - connected via Ethernet cable. I run 2 endpoints using Ropiee - again always solid as a rock. The symptoms are:

• Roon will play for about 20secs to a minute then pause - I have to push play again to re commence playback
• One of my Ropiee endpoints would normally show album art - but doesn't now
• Whichever remote I use, PC, Ipad or Iphone, Roon takes a while to find the server
• I've had to re login to Roon multiple times
• I've had to re-activate the end points a few times.

I think I have a hardware problem with the NUC potentially but thought it worth reaching out in case anyone else had this issue wit the most recent ROON ROCK update. I've re-installed ROCK a few times from the menu - nothing seems to work.

We are about to shift house so I'm going to pack it all away but was keen to resolve before I did.

 

AJ

[Dolphy]

Are you using Tidal? If so, you could be playing Tidal on another device.

[Demondes]

Roon released 1.8 (Build 923) have you installed that as there were a number of fixes relating to crashes.

 

• Web Displays and Chromecast overhaul
• Now Playing screen refinement
• Resolved a bug that could lead to repeated core crashes or significant increase in outbound internet traffic from the core
• Improvement to search results when queried on part of a complete name
• Improvements to scrolling and graphical performance on iOS and other platforms
• Resolved an issue causing a crash in an attempt to add a track to the library with no library performances after visiting its composition details page
• Resolved an issue where the content would be shifted on the browser’s page with an active text filter after returning from the details page
• Resolved widget alignment issue in Composition section of the Search results page
• Resolved an issue with a cropped text on the Onboarding page on Mobile
• Resolved a crash in case of pressing “/” key while Credits tab is open
• Resolved a variety of UI issues on an iPad 6 mini in portrait mode
• Resolved a crash on iOS caused by Thai OS localization
• Added absent week days strings to the translation system
• Fixed absence of certain play actions on playlist and daily mix pages
• Fixed inactive “Device info” link on Zone Settings pop-up
• Removed incorrectly displayed bit-depth info for lossy codecs

[BugPowderDust]

The Roon iOS app is appalling at the moment. Lots of crashes. Barely usable running latest iOS (15.4.1) on an iPhone 12 and latest Roon version (1.8 build 923).

[awayward]

14 minutes ago, BugPowderDust said:

The Roon iOS app is appalling at the moment. Lots of crashes. Barely usable running latest iOS (15.4.1) on an iPhone 12 and latest Roon version (1.8 build 923).

I totally agree, the iOS app has been garbage for years, in my case it is usable but not stable at all. I get one or two crashes daily, it refreshes all the time, losing where it is and not displaying the current screen, I have pretty basic setup so there really is no reason for these issues on my iPad.

[BugPowderDust]

I gave my phone a reboot and reinstalled the app and it’s a bit better but still hot trash. The desktop version seems a lot happier 

[Grizaudio]

4 hours ago, BugPowderDust said:

The Roon iOS app is appalling at the moment. Lots of crashes. Barely usable running latest iOS (15.4.1) on an iPhone 12 and latest Roon version (1.8 build 923).

 

I don't experience any crashes. 

Scrolling is also fine on 923. 

 

I had some issues with the app when running Wifi endpoints. I now run my end points via wired ethernet. 

 

Roon is easily the best audio software going around. 

Nothing else gets close, or provides the visual user experience Roon does.  

I ran an active speaker setup using Roon DSP, Chromecast displays, Nuc Rock server. No issues. 

Edited April 2, 2022 by Grizaudio

[BugPowderDust]

8 hours ago, Grizaudio said:

Roon is easily the best audio software going around. 

Nothing else gets close, or provides the visual user experience Roon does.  

I’m a big fan of Roon and I have over 10 Roon zones in my home (all wired). But the user experience of the app isn’t the best out there, not by a long shot. Many things are convoluted, required steps in and then out of parts of the interface to do things in counterintuitive fashion.

 

I think that the overwhelming capabilities has made the UI pretty cludgy. I often wish they would do a rethink on the way grouping of zones, setting volumes and dealing with deleting items from the queue. I’ve had friends try and use it and just look bewildered when they are so used to Spotify or sonos. 

[Grizaudio]

6 hours ago, BugPowderDust said:

I’m a big fan of Roon and I have over 10 Roon zones in my home (all wired). But the user experience of the app isn’t the best out there, not by a long shot. Many things are convoluted, required steps in and then out of parts of the interface to do things in counterintuitive fashion.

 

I think that the overwhelming capabilities has made the UI pretty cludgy. I often wish they would do a rethink on the way grouping of zones, setting volumes and dealing with deleting items from the queue. I’ve had friends try and use it and just look bewildered when they are so used to Spotify or sonos. 

 

IMO ..... The interface needs to allow customisation of tile selection. 

Allowing individuals to set what tiles appear on there home page etc. 

The software does so much, that options are a plenty - I'm not sure Roon can simplify further unless functions are removed. 

 

I mostly listen at my office desk and Hifi room. So grouping etc is not really something I use. 

On the whole, I feel Roon is pretty simple to use. 

 

I would like to see remote streaming via the app though. 

 

I don't have any real issues with the app. 

Show me another piece of software that comes close to the functionality, customisation and GUI? It cant be easy to keep everyone happy. 

And with soo much deviation between home networks and devices - Its amazing its so stable. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 3, 2022 by Grizaudio

[MattyW]

I used to have these sorts of issues with some regularity and went through a few Wi-Fi configurations before I got it ironed out:

 

1) 3x Google Wi-Fi pucks - With end points plugged directly into Google Wi-Fi Pucks

Worked well most of the time but whenever it got humid or was raining would drop out as you are experiencing

 

2) Xiaomi AX3600 as a stand alone wireless router

Best signal strength of any stand alone unit I've tried but the same performance issues I've always found running a single wireless router

 

3.) 3x Xiaomi AX3600 as router in a wireless mesh config

Still random end point dropouts and issues re-detecting the Core. Absolutely incredible blazing fast file copy across the network though.

 

4) Firewalla Gold as router + 3x Xiaomi AX3600 as mesh access points

This just did not work at all as it lost the Mesh smarts causing issues on smartphones and portable devices around the home

 

5) Firewalla Gold as router + Renolabs Ultimate Audio Switch + 3x TP-Link Deco X60 as mesh access points + 1x TP-Link AC1200 on it's own VLAN for IoT devices. 2x End points are plugged directly into Deco X60's.

This is absolutely seamless with zero issues of any kind. It doesn't have the copy performance of the 3x AX3600 in mesh mode but seamless problem free operation with everything which frankly is more important to me. If I want better performance I'd just go higher up the TP-Link range.

 

I did over time experiment with the best location on the network for the Roon Core and found best results were with it hanging off the Renolabs switch though if I configured an additional port on the Firewalla Gold on the same VLAN as the home network I'm sure that would work just as well from a reliability stand point. This puts the least amount of data across the wireless network.

 

I've also experimented with a few different servers including:

 

1) Roon server on an LPS powered Windows 11 mini PC

Mostly fairly trouble free. Occasional issues.

 

2) Roon server in a Docker container on UnRAID

No end of logging on to keep an eye on UnRAID. Not worth the effort. Often issues after Roon version updates.

 

3) Roon server in a Docker container on TrueNAS

A royal pain in the klacker to set up but absolutely amazing performance. Once set up it just worked but just setting up simple things like file shares takes ages.

 

4) Roon server in a Docker container on a Synology DS1621+ NAS

Expensive, but easy to set up and just forget about it. If there's anything wrong the NAS email me so I don't need to keep an eye on it. Love this solution.

 

By and large I'm moving away from Windows and Raspberry Pi Roon End Points in favour of Roon Ready compliant FPGA endpoints such as the Soundaware A1X or the Accurate Audio N1000 I have on order. Just seems to sound better than running a DDC + high precision OCXO clock though is without doubt less flexible.

 

But yeah, basically I found that Roon needs rock solid network performance to work well or you get all sorts of problems. Ditto the hardware Roon Core/Server runs on. I just wish my home were wired for ethernet as that really would be ideal but for those of us stuck with using Wi-Fi it can be a frustrating and expensive journey.

Edited April 3, 2022 by MattyW

[Ralph]

I run a Roon Nucleus with iMac and iPads as clients. Music is stored on a NAS

I occasionally get this and it seems to be between the Nucleus and my endpoint. Switching them off (and the hub in between) for a few minutes seems to resolve this.

 

A few housekeeping things you could do:

In Roon Settings:

• Force rescan
• Clean up Library

Advanced actions

in Roon Settings

• Clear Cache (Settings - Setup - Clear Image cache)

On client computer

• Clear Roon Preferences (~Library / Roon, for mac OS)

 

Hope this helps

[MattyW]

1 hour ago, Ralph said:

I run a Roon Nucleus with iMac and iPads as clients. Music is stored on a NAS

I occasionally get this and it seems to be between the Nucleus and my endpoint. Switching them off (and the hub in between) for a few minutes seems to resolve this.

 

A few housekeeping things you could do:

In Roon Settings:

• Force rescan
• Clean up Library

Advanced actions

in Roon Settings

• Clear Cache (Settings - Setup - Clear Image cache)

On client computer

• Clear Roon Preferences (~Library / Roon, for mac OS)

 

Hope this helps

 

I've found this doesn't always work. Often better to go to a (much) older backup and lose changes to your playlists/library. Worst case scenario though and I've been largely problem free since moving it onto my NAS.

[Grizaudio]

13 hours ago, MattyW said:

I used to have these sorts of issues with some regularity and went through a few Wi-Fi configurations before I got it ironed out:

 

1) 3x Google Wi-Fi pucks - With end points plugged directly into Google Wi-Fi Pucks

Worked well most of the time but whenever it got humid or was raining would drop out as you are experiencing

 

2) Xiaomi AX3600 as a stand alone wireless router

Best signal strength of any stand alone unit I've tried but the same performance issues I've always found running a single wireless router

 

3.) 3x Xiaomi AX3600 as router in a wireless mesh config

Still random end point dropouts and issues re-detecting the Core. Absolutely incredible blazing fast file copy across the network though.

 

4) Firewalla Gold as router + 3x Xiaomi AX3600 as mesh access points

This just did not work at all as it lost the Mesh smarts causing issues on smartphones and portable devices around the home

 

5) Firewalla Gold as router + Renolabs Ultimate Audio Switch + 3x TP-Link Deco X60 as mesh access points + 1x TP-Link AC1200 on it's own VLAN for IoT devices. 2x End points are plugged directly into Deco X60's.

This is absolutely seamless with zero issues of any kind. It doesn't have the copy performance of the 3x AX3600 in mesh mode but seamless problem free operation with everything which frankly is more important to me. If I want better performance I'd just go higher up the TP-Link range.

 

I did over time experiment with the best location on the network for the Roon Core and found best results were with it hanging off the Renolabs switch though if I configured an additional port on the Firewalla Gold on the same VLAN as the home network I'm sure that would work just as well from a reliability stand point. This puts the least amount of data across the wireless network.

 

I've also experimented with a few different servers including:

 

1) Roon server on an LPS powered Windows 11 mini PC

Mostly fairly trouble free. Occasional issues.

 

2) Roon server in a Docker container on UnRAID

No end of logging on to keep an eye on UnRAID. Not worth the effort. Often issues after Roon version updates.

 

3) Roon server in a Docker container on TrueNAS

A royal pain in the klacker to set up but absolutely amazing performance. Once set up it just worked but just setting up simple things like file shares takes ages.

 

4) Roon server in a Docker container on a Synology DS1621+ NAS

Expensive, but easy to set up and just forget about it. If there's anything wrong the NAS email me so I don't need to keep an eye on it. Love this solution.

 

By and large I'm moving away from Windows and Raspberry Pi Roon End Points in favour of Roon Ready compliant FPGA endpoints such as the Soundaware A1X or the Accurate Audio N1000 I have on order. Just seems to sound better than running a DDC + high precision OCXO clock though is without doubt less flexible.

 

But yeah, basically I found that Roon needs rock solid network performance to work well or you get all sorts of problems. Ditto the hardware Roon Core/Server runs on. I just wish my home were wired for ethernet as that really would be ideal but for those of us stuck with using Wi-Fi it can be a frustrating and expensive journey.

I’ve been trouble free with Orbi, nuc rock, RPI4, Motu mk5 ultra lite. 
 

I run an active speaker setup with Roon handling all crossovers and PEQ, time correction etc. 

IMO once your network is stable, most issues come from software glitches introduced by Roon. 
 

Release 923 has released IOS app issues/compatibility issues with current IOS, app crashes and play/pause delays randomly.

 

Lots of threads discussing it. 

 
 

Edited April 4, 2022 by Grizaudio

[MattyW]

23 minutes ago, Grizaudio said:

I’ve been trouble free with Orbi, nuc rock, RPI4, Motu mk5 ultra lite. 
 

I run an active speaker setup with Roon handling all crossovers and PEQ, time correction etc. 

IMO once your network is stable, most issues come from software glitches introduced by Roon. 
 

Release 923 has released app issues, crashes and play pause delays. 
 

I guess I’ve just been lucky enough not to experience these issues then. My network is rock solid these days despite end points being on the end of wireless links. Took quite a bit to get to this point.

[Grizaudio]

https://community.roonlabs.com/t/roon-1-8-build-923-feedback/197251/156

 

https://community.roonlabs.com/t/music-slow-to-start-any-source-since-build-923/197418/5

 

Pause to play delay, identified as a software issue. 
 

 

Edited April 4, 2022 by Grizaudio

[sfdoddsy]

Much as I love what Roon offers, I really wish they'd properly fix its functional issues.

 

The current release has memory leaks on Mac Monterey and constant crashes on Windows 11.

 

I'm tempted to go ROCK, but threads like this show that it too has issues.

 

Despite their other faults, for me Apple Music and Tidal always just work.

 

With Roon I'm in a constant loop of adjusting my hardware to make up for their deficiencies in basic software engineering.

 

It is very annoying.

 

A stable alternative is a huge risk to their business model.

 

 

[MattyW]

It works beautifully on the Synology NAS. I have scheduled stop starts of the Roon service every few days to take care of memory leaks.