MattyW Posted April 27, 2023 Author Posted April 27, 2023 (edited) 24 minutes ago, tripitaka said: So very true This forum has the best mods in the world, supported by great site policies that let expertise and constructive dialogue shine through. The forum has brought enormous value to my life One of the few places where objective and subjective crowds get along for the most part. It’s when I post elsewhere I’m reminded why I generally don’t go anywhere else with any regularity. Edited April 27, 2023 by MattyW 4
MattyW Posted April 27, 2023 Author Posted April 27, 2023 (edited) Ha, it seems the reason the Lii Song Canada distributor shows different data for the Platinum-10 is they accidentally uploaded the Silver-10 data against it. Whoopsie Leo at Lii Song spent the day testing some Fostex FE206 drivers yesterday.... Says measurements nothing like published specs either which would tend to indicate interaction with the room and potentially measuring equipment. Basically unless you do your testing in the same room with the same gear, you're going to get different measurements. Edited April 28, 2023 by MattyW typo 1
jakesplace Posted April 28, 2023 Posted April 28, 2023 Hello Matty, nice speakers, no doubt the drivers will prove themselves. That DIY forum has turned into a gladiator pit of f'wits. Andrew builds quality pieces of fine furniture when he does a cabinet, I'm glad he is in qld now. What crossovers do you have for it? 1 1
MattyW Posted April 28, 2023 Author Posted April 28, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, jakesplace said: Hello Matty, nice speakers, no doubt the drivers will prove themselves. That DIY forum has turned into a gladiator pit of f'wits. Andrew builds quality pieces of fine furniture when he does a cabinet, I'm glad he is in qld now. What crossovers do you have for it? Yes, its incredible the negativity and carry on over there. It thought it was just ASR and various Facebook groups were like that but sadly I was mistaken. Yes, I'm incredibly lucky Andrew is in Queensland or these amazing speakers could never have been built. There are no crossovers in these speakers. Just the EIZZ EZ-301 gold plated OFC copper low mass binding posts and Mundorf Angelique CAW copper/silver/gold alloy wire going direct to the Lii Song Platinum-10 drivers. The less the better in my mind as it allows more of the energy from the amp through unmolested. A single run from amp to speaker driver bypassing binding posts would give better results again but is just not very practical. It's what I love about great full range drivers as going all out on high end Duelund caps, inductors, resistors etc is exceptionally expensive. The Mundorf wire on the other hand was just $800. It seems I made some good choices given the early results we're now seeing Edited April 28, 2023 by MattyW 1
jakesplace Posted April 28, 2023 Posted April 28, 2023 Do you only have the Angelique wire between the binding posts and drivers ?
MattyW Posted April 28, 2023 Author Posted April 28, 2023 5 minutes ago, jakesplace said: Do you only have the Angelique wire between the binding posts and drivers ? That's right yes. I've FoilFlex speaker cables between amp and speaker binding posts. I changed the binding posts on the amp for EIZZ EZ-301 low mass posts also. They just seem to get out of the way better than anything else I've tried. Pretty inexpensive too
Bryan S Posted May 3, 2023 Posted May 3, 2023 I'm glad I just happened to stumble on this thread Matty - I just spoke with Steve Deckert today but had no idea he was designing a cabinet for these. I was very close to buying some Cube Magus 8" drivers, beautiful things, but this thread has me headed back for the P-10's, which I can buy from Steve along with my Torii Jr Nice build, they're beautiful and must sound amazing. 1 1
MattyW Posted May 3, 2023 Author Posted May 3, 2023 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Bryan S said: I'm glad I just happened to stumble on this thread Matty - I just spoke with Steve Deckert today but had no idea he was designing a cabinet for these. I was very close to buying some Cube Magus 8" drivers, beautiful things, but this thread has me headed back for the P-10's, which I can buy from Steve along with my Torii Jr Nice build, they're beautiful and must sound amazing. Better every time I listen to them. Last night there was a big apparent drop in volume but no, it was a far larger difference between quiet and loud sections. Improved dynamics. Burn in continues and they continue to surprise me with just how good reproduced sound can be If you get Steves new back loaded horns with PT-10's be sure to update me or point me towards any thread you may start? I'd love to read about those as they look very interesting Edited May 3, 2023 by MattyW
Bryan S Posted May 3, 2023 Posted May 3, 2023 1 minute ago, MattyW said: Better every time I listen to them. Last night there was a big apparent drop in volume but no, it was a far larger difference between quiet and loud sections. Improved dynamics. Burn in continues If you get Steves new back loaded horns with PT-10's be sure to update me or point me towards any thread you may start? I'd love to read about those as they look very interesting I certainly will, I'll call him tomorrow. If he's got something complete, I'll jump right on it and build it this month! Really glad I didn't drop $3300 US on the Cubes, they're beautiful and supposed to be very good, but when I saw what you had to say about some of the finer details of the P-10 it sealed my confidence (and saved me enough money to buy more tubes!) I'll report back after my conversation with Steve tomorrow. 1
muon* Posted May 3, 2023 Posted May 3, 2023 20 minutes ago, Bryan S said: I certainly will, I'll call him tomorrow. If he's got something complete, I'll jump right on it and build it this month! Really glad I didn't drop $3300 US on the Cubes, they're beautiful and supposed to be very good, but when I saw what you had to say about some of the finer details of the P-10 it sealed my confidence (and saved me enough money to buy more tubes!) I'll report back after my conversation with Steve tomorrow. You can see Steve's build of the BLH's here https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1679084789/50 1 1
MattyW Posted May 3, 2023 Author Posted May 3, 2023 4 minutes ago, Andrew Tilsley said: That Decware horn looks the business. It does. The perfect solution for those running fleawatt tube amps.
Jehuty Posted May 3, 2023 Posted May 3, 2023 36 minutes ago, Andrew Tilsley said: That Decware horn looks the business. I actually think they look ordinary and wouldn't hold a candle to yours. 1
muon* Posted May 3, 2023 Posted May 3, 2023 3 minutes ago, Jehuty said: I actually think they look ordinary and wouldn't hold a candle to yours. Agree, wood vs mdf. And the sheer size! One expects to see a group of hominids waving bones at the base of each speaker 1 2
MattyW Posted May 3, 2023 Author Posted May 3, 2023 (edited) 38 minutes ago, muon* said: Agree, wood vs mdf. And the sheer size! One expects to see a group of hominids waving bones at the base of each speaker Sound spectacular too….. These are the closest thing to a no compromise build I will ever own. Also the last pair of speakers. Large size means avoiding moving then at all costs Apparently 600L is ideal for Platinum-10 but doing that would make the speakers 1/3 again larger. I’ll never own a home large enough to fit that in so the nearly 480L of these is the next best thing and European birch ply is to my understanding as good as it gets for a speaker build. The Decware looks space saving though big cabinets should sound better yes. Edited May 3, 2023 by MattyW 1
Bryan S Posted May 3, 2023 Posted May 3, 2023 8 hours ago, muon* said: You can see Steve's build of the BLH's here https://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1679084789/50 Thanks Ian! That's quite a beast of a cabinet he's designing, still may prove to be too large for my space. I'll inquire about the Platinum 8. It looks like Steve is trying to backload that speaker as much as possible to keep the overall volume down, but it still looks like a big piece of real estate! Will post the results of my (hopeful) conversation later today
Bryan S Posted May 3, 2023 Posted May 3, 2023 Just spoke with Steve, sounds like he really hit the gong with that folded horn he's designed. Still a formidable beast of a cabinet, 5' tall, 14" wide, not sure but over 24" deep, maybe closer to 28! So I asked him when he thought the 8" Platinums might be introduced, and he had no idea. He also wasn't sure if he was going to do a cabinet for them, but that's not impossible. 8" would be ideal for my space and I may wait if it's going to be soon enough. Matty - any chance of you tugging on your friend's ear and getting the scoop on the 8" version? 1
MattyW Posted May 3, 2023 Author Posted May 3, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, Bryan S said: Just spoke with Steve, sounds like he really hit the gong with that folded horn he's designed. Still a formidable beast of a cabinet, 5' tall, 14" wide, not sure but over 24" deep, maybe closer to 28! So I asked him when he thought the 8" Platinums might be introduced, and he had no idea. He also wasn't sure if he was going to do a cabinet for them, but that's not impossible. 8" would be ideal for my space and I may wait if it's going to be soon enough. Matty - any chance of you tugging on your friend's ear and getting the scoop on the 8" version? I’ll ask. I believe 10” is what they’re launching with. I had a chat yesterday and Leo said that demand for these reference drivers has been stronger than expected and they’re all but sold out of their first production batch already! Based on this I suspect their priority may be on building more before expanding the range although they have developed models right down to 6”. I’ll ask anyway. Edited May 3, 2023 by MattyW 1
Bryan S Posted May 3, 2023 Posted May 3, 2023 Well I just went ahead and placed my order for a pair of PT-10s, especially given your info. I've already cleared the news with my SO, went and found a big cabinet almost the exact size of my next mad creation, and she said "yeah so what's wrong with that?" She's gotten used to it and is very supportive, lucky me. Even the 300L version horn Steve designed is damned big in my 18 sq/m room! Going Japanese! 4 1
Solder blob Posted May 4, 2023 Posted May 4, 2023 Interesting this thread has drawn in multiple R8 thread enthusiasts. Maybe a coincidence? From my perspective I see a value proposition here, even at 2k for the drivers. I'm tempted to upset my SO to build these monsters..I'm curious what the numbers, if assumed to be a bit optimistic. I know this question is subjective, but do these seem to be in the ballpark as efficient as claimed? 1 1
MattyW Posted May 4, 2023 Author Posted May 4, 2023 (edited) Mind blown again today. My wife went to work so took the opportunity to crank my system up a bit and listen to a few tracks which are outside of my normal listening experience. The first track was Highlife by The O Zone Percussion Group. Spectacularly lifelike with massive scale. The drums have real impact which vibrated not just the couch though my timber floors as well. I've never experienced this without a sub before. Music not just heard though felt through your body and also through your feet. Impressive, particularly given this is a single full range driver. Next up was "You Wanna Stay" off Infected Mushrooms Shroomeez EP. Trippy electronica but fast, impactful, in no way muddled as I'd come to expect with other full range drivers. Nothing is lost here. Not my favourite music but an interesting test nonetheless. Next was Electrified II off Yellos album, Toy. More detail and instruments audible I've not noticed before and damn isn't that bass just huge! Heck, these things are everything I could have hoped for and more. What is hard to get my head around is that burn in/break in has barely begun. My experience has been anything with gold in it takes a long long time to burn in so maybe a few months on the Mundorf Angelique CAW wire. The drivers will likely be somewhere from 150 to 300 hours but seriously I can't imagine better than what I'm already getting. This is spectacular! Edited May 4, 2023 by MattyW 3 1
MattyW Posted May 4, 2023 Author Posted May 4, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Solder blob said: Interesting this thread has drawn in multiple R8 thread enthusiasts. Maybe a coincidence? From my perspective I see a value proposition here, even at 2k for the drivers. I'm tempted to upset my SO to build these monsters..I'm curious what the numbers, if assumed to be a bit optimistic. I know this question is subjective, but do these seem to be in the ballpark as efficient as claimed? Very very efficient..... A little too efficient in my setup actually as my pre uses a resistor ladder. It's set for the lowest possible sensitivity however it's too loud for my wife. My power amp for reference is a 15WPC VFET single ended class A design. Pretty sure you'd be find pairing with any number of 2WPC or lower amps no worries. They seem to gain efficiency with burn in. R8 thread.... AudioGD R8 or Willsenton R8 or something else? Just trying to determine if it attracts people like a certain type of sound, or whether the driver efficiency is the thing of most interest Edited May 4, 2023 by MattyW
MattyW Posted May 4, 2023 Author Posted May 4, 2023 One thing surprises me regularly is how many tracks have not synth based keyboards but rather a proper piano. You can hear the deep resonance of the metallic internal structure of the piano on low notes. I think these speakers are spoiling me. I don't think I can live with normal sized speakers again! 1
Bryan S Posted May 4, 2023 Posted May 4, 2023 1 hour ago, MattyW said: R8 thread.... AudioGD R8 or Willsenton R8 or something else? Just trying to determine if it attracts people like a certain type of sound, or whether the driver efficiency is the thing of most interest Willsenton, it's quite the happy, dysfunctional family over there! It's pretty mod focused, since for some reason the R8 just likes the attention and is ripe for the picking. I completely reworked mine, it's not even the same amp anymore. Now I'm going to ditch it for a 4-6 watt SET! 1 1
MattyW Posted May 4, 2023 Author Posted May 4, 2023 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Bryan S said: Willsenton, it's quite the happy, dysfunctional family over there! It's pretty mod focused, since for some reason the R8 just likes the attention and is ripe for the picking. I completely reworked mine, it's not even the same amp anymore. Now I'm going to ditch it for a 4-6 watt SET! A good move that. Have you looked at the Line Magnetic built Western Electric remake amps that are available via Aliexpress? After a rewire and recap they're meant to be quite special You don't need much power for great sound..... Just an amp with great sound and high efficiency speakers Edited May 4, 2023 by MattyW
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