john.reekie Posted January 1, 2024 Posted January 1, 2024 (edited) Further Information: Great-sounding unit in very good condition, I've had no issues at all. Some marks on the top, see photos. Thought I would be keeping this one forever...! This is Yamaha's flagship processor from 2013, so the feature set corresponds to the state of the art back then. The audio quality, balanced outputs etc, don't change It originally retailed for $3900, the current model CX-A5200 is $4299. I've attached a screenshot from the manual with the I/O specs, the unit doesn't support Atmos but does support 4k. I've confirmed that with the Apple TV, it works with 4k@50Hz in SDR but not HDR. I don't have a 4k Blu-ray player to test anything else. It's basically 7.1 but there are additional outputs to synthesize additional "presence" channels. You can find the documentation online here: https://au.yamaha.com/en/support/manuals/index.html?l=en&k=CX-A5000 3rd-party measurements here: https://www.audioholics.com/av-preamp-processor-reviews/yamaha-aventage-cx-a5000-mx/#toc-h2-7 Comes with remote and YPAO puck, original box/packaging. The remote has a bit of a mark on the top, see photo. Let me know if any questions or if you need any particular tests done and I will do what I can Edited January 11, 2024 by john.reekie
Mach3 Posted January 1, 2024 Posted January 1, 2024 Does this unit do HDMI pass through, and support HDMI 2.1/2.2?
john.reekie Posted January 2, 2024 Author Posted January 2, 2024 Hi, I found this: "The pass-through transmission of HDMI 4K (60 Hz/50 Hz) 4:2:0 signals becomes available." I'm not sure how this is supposed to work (to test it) though - HDMI goes to the TV even when the processor is in standby? https://europe.yamaha.com/files/download/other_assets/8/331768/web_ZN93750_CX-A5000_Add_Feature_Flyer_CTKGLVF_EnFrDeEsRuZhKo.pdf I can't find anywhere in the specs where it states an HDMI version, but I expect it would be no to the HDMI 2.1/2.2 question. I need to add some more context to the ad (my bad) - this is Yamaha's flagship processor from 2013, so would be about the state of the art back then.
bizzibee Posted January 2, 2024 Posted January 2, 2024 (edited) On 01/01/2024 at 10:58 PM, Mach3 said: Does this unit do HDMI pass through, and support HDMI 2.1/2.2? Expand The YAMAHA AVENTAGE CX-A5000 Pre-Amplifier does not support HDCP 2.2. The YAMAHA AVENTAGE CX-A5100 Pre-Amplifier does support HDCP 2.2. See: https://faq.yamaha.com/usa/s/article/U0008876 This review states the CX-A5000 has eight HDMI 1.4 inputs and two HDMI outputs. See: https://www.soundandvision.com/content/yamaha-cx-a5000-surround-processor-and-mx-a5000-amplifier HDMI 1.4b Specification: https://www.hdmi.org/spec/hdmi1_4b Edited January 4, 2024 by bizzibee 2
bizzibee Posted January 2, 2024 Posted January 2, 2024 I know that I linked to a review that stated that the CX-A5000 has eight HDMI 1.4 inputs and two HDMI outputs. But on the product page for the CX-A5000 on all the Yamaha Web sites world wide it states this. Which is a bit confusing since the HDMI 1.4 standard only supported 4096×2160 at 24 Hz, 3840×2160 at 24, 25, and 30 Hz, and 1920×1080 at 120 Hz. Quote Support for HDMI 2.0 Specification This model will support HDMI 2.0 connectivity*.It will support 4K Ultra HD 50 Hz/60 Hz signal pass-through to output motion-smooth high definition videos. *Firmware update to support this feature has been available since 2014 Jun. Expand Taken from: https://au.yamaha.com/en/products/audio_visual/av_receivers_amps/cx-a5000/features.html#product-tabs https://usa.yamaha.com/products/audio_visual/av_receivers_amps/cx-a5000/features.html#product-tabs https://uk.yamaha.com/en/products/audio_visual/av_receivers_amps/cx-a5000/features.html#product-tabs https://jp.yamaha.com/products/audio_visual/av_receivers_amps/cx-a5000__j/specs.html#product-tabs Japanese to English translation: https://jp-yamaha-com.translate.goog/products/audio_visual/av_receivers_amps/cx-a5000__j/specs.html?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=wapp#product-tabs The CX-A5000 was released in late 2013. See: https://www.whathifi.com/news/yamaha-reveals-top-range-aventage-a5000-av-separates HDMI Version 2.0 was released on 4 September 2013 around the same time that the CX-A5000 was released, and HDMI Version 1.4b was released on 11 October 2011. So I am unsure how Yamaha was going to provide HDMI 2.0 connectivity to support 4K Ultra HD 50 Hz/60 Hz signal pass-through via a firmware update. https://www.electronics-notes.com/articles/audio-video/hdmi/hdmi-versions.php Anyway, I guess you could strip off the HDCP 2.2 using a cheap HDMI 2.0a/HDCP 2.2 splitter that ignores/strip out HDCP if Yamaha did provide said firmware update to provide HDMI 2.0 connectivity to support 4K Ultra HD 50 Hz/60 Hz signal pass-through. But you would have to verify that the splitter you purchased does in fact strips off the HDCP because not all of them do. If the User reviews on Amazon for this OREI UltraHD 4K @ 60 Hz 1 X 2 HDMI Splitter are to be trusted, then it strips out HDCP. See: https://www.amazon.com.au/OREI-UltraHD-HDMI-Splitter-Port/dp/B07J2Q9NPH/ref=asc_df_B07J2Q9NPH/?th=1 Quote Top reviews from Australia Ben Graham 5.0 out of 5 stars Fixed my HDCP problem Reviewed in Australia on 4 August 2023 Style Name: HDMI 4K SplitterSize Name: 2 PortVerified Purchase I bought this splitter because my older tv would not hdcp with my apple tv (in disney+ prime etc). It fixed the problem! $50 was much less then buying a new tv. 4k 60hz, works great. Expand Quote Tom ward 5.0 out of 5 stars Bypasses HDCP 2.2, works better than specifications. Reviewed in Australia on 23 February 2020 Style Name: HDMI 4K SplitterSize Name: 2 PortVerified Purchase Best $80 I have ever spent. Works past its specification for cable length with the finer-optic cables, bypasses HDCP 2.2 And is extremely easy to set up. Honestly, this thing should be worth a lot more than you pay. Expand But do your own research to confirm.
john.reekie Posted January 3, 2024 Author Posted January 3, 2024 Hi, thanks for all the info! I did test it with 4k@50 Hz from an Apple TV, it works in SDR but not HDR.
john.reekie Posted January 3, 2024 Author Posted January 3, 2024 I have to say, if the aim of the HDMI consortium has been to confuse the heck out of consumers, they have succeeded! 1
bizzibee Posted January 3, 2024 Posted January 3, 2024 (edited) On 03/01/2024 at 12:56 AM, john.reekie said: Hi, thanks for all the info! I did test it with 4k@50 Hz from an Apple TV, it works in SDR but not HDR. Expand You're welcome. Thanks for confirming 4K Ultra HD 50 Hz/60 Hz signal pass-through. Was that directly or via HDMi splitter that strip off the HDCP playing copy protected content or just using the video tests in the Apple TV itself with wouldn't have HDCP? I'm guessing via the video tests in the Apple TV itself. Yes there is no way it would support HDR given its age. Yamaha must have made good on that promise of the firmware update to support 4K Ultra HD 50 Hz/60 Hz signal pass-through. Edited January 3, 2024 by bizzibee
bizzibee Posted January 3, 2024 Posted January 3, 2024 (edited) On 03/01/2024 at 12:57 AM, john.reekie said: I have to say, if the aim of the HDMI consortium has been to confuse the heck out of consumers, they have succeeded! Expand Yes they certainly have. Only two standards listed on their site: https://www.hdmi.org/spec/index HDMI 1.4b HDMI 2.1b What a joke. That dosn't help anyone trying to find out that their device supports. People have a find a site that does provide the older HDMI standards such as: https://www.electronics-notes.com/articles/audio-video/hdmi/hdmi-versions.php Edited January 3, 2024 by bizzibee
john.reekie Posted January 3, 2024 Author Posted January 3, 2024 On 03/01/2024 at 2:29 AM, bizzibee said: You're welcome. Thanks for confirming 4K Ultra HD 50 Hz/60 Hz signal pass-through. Was that directly or via HDMi splitter that strip off the HDCP playing copy protected content or just using the video tests in the Apple TV itself with wouldn't have HDCP? Expand Hi, it was playing Netflix (Bladerunner 2049 iirc). Connected directly, no splitter etc, TV is LG C2. Maybe the Apple TV doesn't send the HDCP since the connected device doesn't support it? tbh I have no idea but surely they can't prevent every legacy device from working?
john.reekie Posted January 3, 2024 Author Posted January 3, 2024 (edited) I found some 3rd-party measurements here: https://www.audioholics.com/av-preamp-processor-reviews/yamaha-aventage-cx-a5000-mx/#toc-h2-7 Edited January 3, 2024 by john.reekie
bizzibee Posted January 3, 2024 Posted January 3, 2024 (edited) On 03/01/2024 at 4:23 AM, john.reekie said: Hi, it was playing Netflix (Bladerunner 2049 iirc). Connected directly, no splitter etc, TV is LG C2. Maybe the Apple TV doesn't send the HDCP since the connected device doesn't support it? tbh I have no idea but surely they can't prevent every legacy device from working? Expand Are you on the 4K Netflix Plan, or one of the 1080p Netflix Plan? Quote Standard with Ads $6.99 Video quality up to 1080p/Full HD Standard $16.99 Video quality up to 1080p/Full HD Premium $22.99 4K Ultra HD and HDR Expand Your YAMAHA AVENTAGE CX-A5000 Pre-Amplifier does not support HDCP 2.2 according to the document below. But the YAMAHA AVENTAGE CX-A5100 Pre-Amplifier does support HDCP 2.2. HDCP 2.2 was released in Sept 2013. See: https://faq.yamaha.com/usa/s/article/U0008876 The above doesn't say anything about HDMI 2.0, so I'm assuming that mean the CX-A5000 has HDMI 2.0 and not HDMI 1.4a which this review states it has. https://www.soundandvision.com/content/yamaha-cx-a5000-surround-processor-and-mx-a5000-amplifier In particular: https://www.soundandvision.com/content/yamaha-cx-a5000-surround-processor-and-mx-a5000-amplifier-specs I don't know if your YAMAHA CX-A5000 has HDCP 1.4 or perhaps 2.1 as HDCP 2.1 was released in July 2011. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-bandwidth_Digital_Content_Protection https://www.cablematters.com/Blog/HDMI/what-is-hdcp-the-complete-guide I am still somewhat confused that your Yamaha CX-A5000 does support 4K Ultra HD 50 Hz/60 Hz if it only has HDMI 1.4a. I don't know how Yamaha has done this via firmware if the Yamaha CX-A5000 only has HDMI 1.4a. I think it does have HDMI 2.0 for this to make any sense at all. But your LG C2 TV does have HDMI 2.1 and HDCP 2.3. I'm not sure if you have the HDMI 2.0a or HDMI 2.1 version of the 4K Apple TV. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_TV HDCP is compatible across versions and typically HDCP support is a black-and-white issue. It either works because the device and display are HDCP compliant, or it doesn't work because they aren't. I'm assuming that between the different version of HDCP in your 4K Apple TV YAMAHA CX-A5000 and your LG C2 TV, you will be limited to 1080p60 or perhaps 2160p30. But without HDR, DV, Atmos etc in a mixed capability system. But you should be able to confirm that by checking the input resolution of the digital signal that the LG C2 TV is receiving from the 4K Apple TV via the YAMAHA CX-A5000. I think this should work for your LG TV to find resolution: "Pick up your magic remote. Shake it until you get a pointer on the tv screen. Press the little scroll wheel button down. This should display the input source in the upper left corner such as "HDMI1". Then motion with the remote until the pointer is over that "HDMI1" and press the little scroll wheel again. That should show the information about that source." But this will just should the resolution not the refresh rate as far as I know. As far as I know, if you have a new device that has the HDMI 2.0a and HDCP 2.2 or HDMI 2.1 and HDCP 2.3 chipsets, and connect that to a device that has a HDMI 1.4 or HDCP 2.1 chipsets, only the protocols that are recognised for HDCP 1.4 or HDCP 2.1 will be available without issues on the device with HDMI 2.1 and HDCP 2.3 chipsets such as your LG C2 TV. Unless you pass the through a HDMI Splitter that strips off the HDCP. I based this information on the minimum requirement for 4K being HDMI 1.4 which will allow the resolution 3840 x 2160 pixels at maximum refresh of 30Hz (4k@30). HDMI 2.0a will allow the refresh rate to go up to 60hz. Again, I am still somewhat confused that your Yamaha CX-A5000 does support 4K Ultra HD 50 Hz/60 Hz. I don't know how Yamaha has done this via firmware if the Yamaha CX-A5000 only has HDMI 1.4 as neither the HDMI or HDCP chipsets are upgradable via firmware as far as I know. I think it has HDMI 2.0 for this to make any sense at all, and more likely HDCP 2.1 Edited January 3, 2024 by bizzibee 1
bizzibee Posted January 3, 2024 Posted January 3, 2024 On 03/01/2024 at 4:28 AM, john.reekie said: I found some 3rd-party measurements here: https://www.audioholics.com/av-preamp-processor-reviews/yamaha-aventage-cx-a5000-mx/#toc-h2-7 Expand Yes but those relate to audio not video and doesn't really tell us anything new.
john.reekie Posted January 4, 2024 Author Posted January 4, 2024 On 03/01/2024 at 11:17 PM, bizzibee said: Are you on the 4K Netflix Plan, or one of the 1080p Netflix Plan? Expand Yes, it's the 4k plan. The Apple TV is model A2843 (128GB) so.... yep HDMI 2.1. I did confirm 4k@50Hz by putting an HDFury Arcana between the CX-A5000 and the LG TV. There were some other letters/numbers but I don't remember them. It doesn't seem, in any case, that the ATV will output anything other than what you set it to, it seems that it converts everything to the specified resolution/rate. That's a neat trick on the TV, lemme see... OK that does show the resolution while playing video. I don't have the CX connected presently but will hook it up again later and try. Unfortunately I don't have a 4k Blu-ray player (or any 4k discs) to try. Oh, the link to the audio specs is unrelated to the HDMI discussion, just adding that information for anyone that might be interested in the unit I discovered yesterday that there's a phono input so I'll give that a whirl later also, it might be a decent 2ch preamp.
john.reekie Posted January 5, 2024 Author Posted January 5, 2024 (edited) To confirm again, the Apple TV set to 4k@50 Hz SDR works through the CX-A5000. The HDFury Arcana says that it is "4K50 297 MHz 420 BT709 8b" It doesn't work with HDR and it doesn't work with 4k@60 Hz Edited January 5, 2024 by john.reekie
bizzibee Posted January 5, 2024 Posted January 5, 2024 On 05/01/2024 at 11:24 AM, john.reekie said: To confirm again, the Apple TV set to 4k@50 Hz SDR works through the CX-A5000. The HDFury Arcana says that it is "4K50 297 MHz 420 BT709 8b" It doesn't work with HDR and it doesn't work with 4k@60 Hz Expand That's for clarifying. I'm sure this will help potential buyers. 1
john.reekie Posted January 6, 2024 Author Posted January 6, 2024 On 05/01/2024 at 11:21 PM, bizzibee said: That's for clarifying. I'm sure this will help potential buyers. Expand Thanks for all your research! Now I just need to find that buyer I forgot to do the remote shaky shaky thing last night, I've done that now and confirmed on the TV that it's 2160p. Another datapoint: the Apple TV is set to YCbCr with 4:2:0 chroma. If I set chroma to 4:4:4, no dice (at 4k@50Hz). However the ATV has a couple of "Match original content" setting. If I set it to match the frame rate, then Netflix "Ultra HD 4k" plays at 24 Hz with 4:4:4 chroma. There is however a blank period of 2-3 seconds while everything gets negotiated. (And I guess this is the reason the ATV interpolates to a fixed resolution/frame rate by default.)
john.reekie Posted January 6, 2024 Author Posted January 6, 2024 (edited) Last call Edited January 11, 2024 by john.reekie
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