Help me choose a CD Player

[crisis]

1 hour ago, Peter_F said:

 

   Plus $1750 buys a shed load of vinyl, but I am trying to 'embrace' digital and the 1800 CeeDees I own! 

 

 

 

 

 

At today's vinyl prices you wouldn't need a big shed. It would buy you about 30 - 40 records....

[David A]

1 hour ago, crisis said:

At today's vinyl prices you wouldn't need a big shed. It would buy you about 30 - 40 records....

It's ironic isn't it? Vinyl prices are going through the roof, whilst new garden variety and used cd's are dirt cheap. Even audiophile cd's are cheap compared to 'audiophile' vinyl pressings. All I can say is, hey i'm not complaining about the fact that my main source is a cd player.
 

Edited August 8, 2024 by David A

[JkSpinner]

Hi all, thought I would jump back in and provide some feedback since I was the one who started the thread.

1.  I found it very difficult to demo a CD player.  As there are very few sold these days, retailers do not seem to carry many, or have them available for home demo.  However, I found streamers readily available for demo, multiple brands.

2. I really wanted separates, as in separate CD player and separate streamer, but did not have the funds or approval to buy both at once unless I bought a cheaper node or something, which would probably have sufficed.  But I was chasing great SQ.  Marantz still make multiple CD players, many manufacturers only make one or two models.  Marantz make many of their internal components rather then source from a third party, and I have heard of many broken reasonable new CDP’s where they could not source parts, so I thought these two points offered a bit of security.  Marantz have made some famous CD players such as the KI Pearl and the Ruby, and I heard that the DAC technology in the 30n was taken from these famous CD players.   I liked the idea of the Marantz SA series, however I hear it’s old tech, and new models are arriving later this year.  And I have never heard anybody unhappy with the High end Marantz CD player.  And when they offered 20% off in June, I could not resist, especially as it included a streamer, and USB connection for my FLAC files.

3.  I was close to pulling the pin on Rotel CDT6000 many times.  Read several great reviews, I loved the look of it, it fitted in the budget really well, but I really wondered why they would drop it, if it was so good, if they spent all that time developing it, why drop it from the line up.  I am always a bit sus on ESS DACs, I had an Oppo 105 which I loved but thought it was a bit bright, I home demo’d a Lumin Streamer which I think was a bit bright, although I have now learnt this brightness was caused by my room, but that thought sticks in your head, so I stayed away from ESS

4.  I look at several others, but really thought the Marantz was the safe bet.

 

since I purchased what do I think.  I absolutely luv the sound when playing CD’s, I think the unit really hits my sweat spot, it really delivers the SQ I was looking for.  No ifs and no buts.  When I demo’d the Lumin which I also loved, I had thoughts of, a bit bright, a bit forward sounding, although that may have something to do with my room.  I do not feel I get the same SQ when used as a streamer, I think the streamer SQ is suffers a little when comparing the streamer to the CD player, but I have not really sat down and compared same song etc.  And then there is the App, HEOS is not simple to use, I don’t like it.  I still think I will end up with a dedicated streamer next year, probably Lumin, but who knows. The CD draw is the smoothest I have ever seen, but there is a very long delay to open it, I will measure it one day, but I reckon it is probs 30 secs.  It’s a PITA.  The remote sucks, way too many buttons with this gold like small print that you cannot read in any light, I hate it really, it’s terrible.  I cannot find a USB drive that works or it supports, so I cannot use my USB SDD to play FLAC files.  I have had to connect it to my NAS.  There is no support from Marantz n Australia that I can find.

At the time of purchase, I was really intending on purchasing a $7000 or $8000 Streamer, although I was struggling with justifying all that cost for a single device.

 

this whole process has turned out well.  During this process, I have moved my HI FI room around to achieve the best SQ, and the best use, I have discovered cables make a difference and upgraded interconnects on my CD player and my TT, invested in isolation feet, made a TT and an Amp plinth, and have started to go down the room treatment path.  All in all, I have spent less than the streamer would have cost.  I have also brought my CD collection back into the music room and installed some CD shelves, and also bought a set of shelves that will house both my records and my wife’s books.  The room looks a whole lot better now, looks like a family media room, Hi Fi, Home Theatre, CD and records on display, guitars and amps, it has really turned out well.  I stream a whole lot more than I thought I would, and enjoy discovering new music, you can only listen to Cold Chisel Last Stand so many times.  
 

next - I will apply some treatments to the room over the next couple of months, and probably buy a streamer in 2025, and that will probably do.  I am already happy, so no need to chase some never ending dream.

[brodricj]

1 hour ago, JkSpinner said:

...you can only listen to Cold Chisel Last Stand so many times. 

Or not at all.

[JkSpinner]

28 minutes ago, brodricj said:

Or not at all.

What sort of Saturday night would that be?

[brodricj]

11 hours ago, JkSpinner said:

What sort of Saturday night would that be?

One devoid of rampant screeching, hopefully.

[Hi-Fi Whipped]

1 hour ago, brodricj said:

One devoid of rampant screeching, hopefully.

Give the derogatory tone a spell, each to their own, listening to the music we love is why we are all here.

[Peter_F]

15 hours ago, JkSpinner said:

3.  I was close to pulling the pin on Rotel CDT6000 many times.  Read several great reviews, I loved the look of it, it fitted in the budget really well, but I really wondered why they would drop it, if it was so good, if they spent all that time developing it, why drop it from the line up.  

 

4.  I look at several others, but really thought the Marantz was the safe bet.

 

 The CD draw is the smoothest I have ever seen, but there is a very long delay to open it, I will measure it one day, but I reckon it is probs 30 secs.  It’s a PITA.  The remote sucks, way too many buttons with this gold like small print that you cannot read in any light, I hate it really, it’s terrible.  I cannot find a USB drive that works or it supports, so I cannot use my USB SDD to play FLAC files.  I have had to connect it to my NAS.  There is no support from Marantz n Australia that I can find.

 

Great post! 

 

I also couldn't understand the rational for 50% price drop on the Rotel if it was that good. Perhaps we're over analysing it and it really is a great player at a bargain price?

 

I don't mind Marantz, but I do struggle with the 'Marantz sound' after long listening sessions. 

 

It's concerning the CD drawer has a long delay and the USB not actually being useable and a horrible remote! Gawd, it would frustrate the bejesus out of me! Its these reasons that an in store demo is important to me.   

[betty boop]

15 hours ago, JkSpinner said:

I absolutely luv the sound when playing CD’s, I think the unit really hits my sweat spot, it really delivers the SQ I was looking for.  No ifs and no buts

 

I am so glad to hear this JK, marantz do make some lovely spinners indeed. and have a long track record on them too.. in all players i have had over the years its marantz i seem to have settled in with too.. and hitting the spot so well. So very pleased to hear has done similarly for you  its a nice feeling when something fits right in  

[David A]

@JkSpinner Congrats on your new cd player. Though i'm still mystified as to what model Marantz player you bought?

[JkSpinner]

10 hours ago, Hi-Fi Whipped said:

Give the derogatory tone a spell, each to their own, listening to the music we love is why we are all here

I was not sure if it was derogatory or a bit of fun, hence why I did not continue.  My comments were a bit of fun.  Since discovering streaming, I have been trying different music, new styles etc and really enjoying it.  Have discovered some new styles / genre’s that are probably not defined, just need to find more music like it.

like a new modern up beat rocky type Jazz, and even similar symphony classical style, upbeat symphony rock, if there is such a thing.

[JkSpinner]

10 hours ago, Peter_F said:

Perhaps we're over analysing it and it really is a great player at a bargain price?

Could not agree more Peter, it was just part of the process, but without the ability to home demo, I could not pull the trigger.  Hopefully I will find someone in BRI that I can borrow and home demo and compare to the Marantz one day.

 

10 hours ago, Peter_F said:

I don't mind Marantz, but I do struggle with the 'Marantz sound' after long listening sessions. 

I hear people talk about the particular Marantz sound, I cannot pick a particular sound, and I think the sound is a combination of source, amp, speaker and now room.

 

10 hours ago, Peter_F said:

It's concerning the CD drawer has a long delay and the USB not actually being useable and a horrible remote! Gawd, it would frustrate the bejesus out of me! Its these reasons that an in store demo is important to me

Yep, but I own it now so need to make piece with it.  I pretty much do not use the remote so tick, I use the NAS instead of the USB so tick, the draw pisses me off though, however as it provides the sound I like, and I will most likely stream more then play CD’s in the future.  I can live with that.  I have been advised by the reseller who spoke to Marantz to find a USB drive with less then 1amp draw (I think it was 1amp) and try that.  I am yet to do this.

[JkSpinner]

10 hours ago, betty boop said:

I am so glad to hear this JK, marantz do make some lovely spinners indeed. and have a long track record on them too.. in all players i have had over the years its marantz i seem to have settled in with too.. and hitting the spot so well. So very pleased to hear has done similarly for you  its a nice feeling when something fits right in  

Hi Snoop, I agree, there were several reasons why I purchased the Marantz, like I said, I have never heard of anybody not happy with a Marantz CDP

[JkSpinner]

6 hours ago, David A said:

Congrats on your new cd player. Though i'm still mystified as to what model Marantz player you bought?

The Marantz SACD 30N

[betty boop]

14 hours ago, Peter_F said:

don't mind Marantz, but I do struggle with the 'Marantz sound' after long listening sessions. 

there’s also denon versions if Marantz is not your liking …
 

14 hours ago, Peter_F said:

It's concerning the CD drawer has a long delay and the USB not actually being useable and a horrible remote! Gawd, it would frustrate the bejesus out of me! Its these reasons that an in store demo is important to me.   

 

Quite a few models to pick from so should be something for everyone … I don’t personally think the drawer on my marantz is slow and own other brands and still do. Things like remotes pick one where like the remote ? USB ? I’d probably get a usb dac for that ? Much choice ? That way don’t have to have player powered up to just use the dac ?

[David A]

8 hours ago, JkSpinner said:

The Marantz SACD 30N

That looks like a very versatile player and is a streamer as well. It is a good looking player, and should be reliable and serviceable long-term which was one of your main concerns. And I see it won an SNA Applause Award  . Are you planning to add the matching integrated amp?
 

Edited August 10, 2024 by David A
typo

[JkSpinner]

8 minutes ago, David A said:

Are you planning to add the matching integrated amp?

No, I have a Michi X5 and luv it.  I have thought about changing the Michi maybe in a few years, just because if it’s weight, I am not getting any younger, and over the last three months have moved it probably seven times

[rantan]

19 hours ago, Peter_F said:

also couldn't understand the rational for 50% price drop on the Rotel if it was that good. Perhaps we're over analysing it and it really is a great player at a bargain price?

 

The story was that Rotel introduced the Diamond series as a 60th anniversary of the company which was ( and is ) supposed to be a bridge between the regular models and the Michi line.

Problem was that the actual sound signature wasn't a night/day difference over the regular cd player line and it became stuck in no-person' land so it became an orphan despite using premium quality parts and with great build quality.

 

As pertaining to this discussion it is a great CD player for $1749 but much less so at $3500.

 

As In have previously stated ,I have no skin in this game, I do not own any Rotel gear, I am not a Rotel fan person and I don' think it is the last word in CD replay,

however...............................in this instance I don't know of any cd player sold as new on the Oz market that would be better than this Rotel at the new street price.

 

IF I was building a CD based system and had two grand to spend,I know where my money would be going.

I have found Marantz ,Denon and Yamaha to be far less appealing for varying reasons.

 

I hope this clarifies some people's thoughts of me being a a rabid Rotel fan person.

 

  Edit: Fixed a few typos

Edited August 10, 2024 by rantan

[migasson]

Hey!

 

im seriously contemplating a Saturn MK3. I think it could be the least digital sounding of all the players. And you don’t see too many pop up for sale used, probably a good sign!

[JkSpinner]

The rega was in my top three or four as well.  As much as I luv the top loader, I simply do not have the space for it

[rockeater]

On 10/08/2024 at 11:36 AM, betty boop said:

there’s also denon versions if Marantz is not your liking …

Overall, Marantz has been a brand name only for decades.
As far as CD players are concerned, it was Philips who owned it in the 80s.

In 2002 it was merged with Denon.

Since then it is owned by investment companies rather than an boutique audio company that we think of.

But strangely, all the owners kept good deal of the design philosophy from the Philips years still in place.

On 10/08/2024 at 3:02 PM, David A said:

, and should be reliable and serviceable long-term which was one of your main concerns.

This we will find out in time.

Some products have poor after sales support but we do not know about it, because they are reliable and hardly ever fail.

Others we do know about, when good number of their production fails after a certain period of time.

In modern players, it is often cheap, $20 DVD laser mechanisms that stop reading and which are then no longer available. No one stocks up on these to start with, because when they are new they work, and there is no demand.
When they stop working, they are no longer in production and you cannot order new ones.

These days only Sanyo made CD laser mechanisms are in good supply and the ones from the 90s are still available at prices that haven't changed much.

[David A]

1 hour ago, rockeater said:

This we will find out in time.

Some products have poor after sales support but we do not know about it, because they are reliable and hardly ever fail.

Others we do know about, when good number of their production fails after a certain period of time.

In modern players, it is often cheap, $20 DVD laser mechanisms that stop reading and which are then no longer available. No one stocks up on these to start with, because when they are new they work, and there is no demand.
When they stop working, they are no longer in production and you cannot order new ones.

These days only Sanyo made CD laser mechanisms are in good supply and the ones from the 90s are still available at prices that haven't changed much.

 

If long-term serviceability of cd players/transports bothers you that much, you're probably better off with a dac/streamer/server combo which is de rigueur these days.

[rantan]

57 minutes ago, David A said:

f with a dac/streamer/server combo which is de rigueur these days.

It is indeed a bandwagon.

 Music companies don't want people owning their own silver or black discs.

Rental music is here to stay unfortunately.

[David A]

24 minutes ago, rantan said:

It is indeed a bandwagon.

 Music companies don't want people owning their own silver or black discs.

Rental music is here to stay unfortunately.

I haven't bought into streaming at all, as I think it's 'soulless'. I much prefer to own the media, be able to enjoy the album art, read the liner notes and interact with my cd player. I also think in most cases physical media sounds better than streaming. And as you elluded to, streaming services randomly delete albums. And those services periodically crash and go down altogether during internet outages. Then there is the privacy aspect which is another rabbit hole. My 2c.

 

Edited September 17, 2024 by David A

[maximus]

Got rid of streaming over 6 months ago ....no regrets, but I am waiting for the day it finally catches up, without spending bucket loads of money on a quality streamer.