Front Speaker Placement

[drummerboy01]

I have a rectangular room 8m in length x 5m in width. My viewing distance is 5m from the front wall, how far apart should my mains be considering i am using a center channel speaker. Audio advice says the fronts should be 4.55m apart for that size room but that would land then 250mm of each side wall. In my photo i have the fronts 3.2 apart and of the front wall 1.1m. I would love your thoughts.

Edited July 11, 2024 by drummerboy01

[Allan]

try the 83% rule, it sounds good & measure very well.

 

 

[drummerboy01]

50 minutes ago, Allan said:

try the 83% rule, it sounds good & measure very well.

 

 

Thanks for the link Allan. I think I will leave them as they are. I never thought about the fact that if I moved them out wider then my first reflection points of my absorption will also need to be moved. What confused me was why Audio Advice would want me to put my mains so close to a side wall. Cheers mate

[JkSpinner]

Hi Drummer boy

i posted a similar question recently.  After some comments, I researched

The Vandersteens method,  but played around with 1/3, 1/5, and 1/7, especially with width

the Cardis golden rule

and played around with rules around equilateral triangles and Isosceles triangles.

its worth having a read, then having a play around.

experimentation is the key I think

best of luck

[JkSpinner]

A couple of extra things, and I am certainly no expert here, I have just done a shed load of googling (if you can call that research) 

your panels appear to be quite high

for speaker placement, ensure that the speakers are different distance from the front wall to the side wall, measured from the front of the speaker.  In the photo, the distances look quite similar.

ps.  I luv your set up, shared also with my kids

[drummerboy01]

9 hours ago, JkSpinner said:

A couple of extra things, and I am certainly no expert here, I have just done a shed load of googling (if you can call that research) 

your panels appear to be quite high

for speaker placement, ensure that the speakers are different distance from the front wall to the side wall, measured from the front of the speaker.  In the photo, the distances look quite similar.

ps.  I luv your set up, shared also with my kids

Yea the idea of my panels was to take out that echo of the room as the majority of the floor is tiled. At the same time i did not overtreat it with absorption. I have taken 4 panels out of the room since that photo. Its an absolute fantastic room and is a huge plus to the sound i am getting. I made sure i did not cut any corners when building the room and opened up a lot more options to go with for my setup and choice of equipment. If there is any advice i could give after having this dedicated room for the past 20 odd years is that it pays to get your room right as it helps with getting a great sound.  I have played around with my Atmos ceiling speakers and moved them in as they used to be in line with the mains which Dolby specifies in one of their illustrations which is totally wrong. After moving them in i could finally hear content from them. I honestly never had a problem with my mains but was just curious as to find out if my overall experience would be better. Maybe my curiosity is getting the better of me. I have never really been one to split hairs. Well not overly too much 

[JkSpinner]

My room is far from perfect, it’s a good size, 6.8 x 4.4m, but has a 1m 45 deg kink in the centre, which Linda moves everything off centre a bit, plus a large glass door, and a large opening to the entrance.  It still sounds great, always has, but I am sure it could easily sound better.  I have spent some time with speaker placement recently, and it makes a huge difference.  I have stuck with different variances of those mathematical guides as starters which have proven beneficial, i think I would like them a little wider.  After listening to several A/B comparisons with headphones, I invested in some GAIA feet for my speakers.  I am told that they make an even bigger difference on tiles, so may be worth considering for you.  I also invested in better interconnects, and GAIA feet for my amp and turntable, and will do the same for my CDP.  It was the placement of the speakers and the feet that made the most difference.

now it’s time to look at treatment, but because of the shape of the room, the glass door and the open wall it gets tricky, but I to am hoping to get rid of some echo

what brand of panels did you use

did you use bass traps as well.

do you use the room for 2 channel and HT

all the best

 

[drummerboy01]

For my panels i used "Martini Absorb HD 100" . They came in a pack of 3 being 2.4m x 1.2m. I cut them into 1.2 x .600m panels. I purchased them through CSR as i have an account with them. I used a sharp knife to cut them with a straight edge piece of timber. They are made of Poly so there is no need to cover them with fabric or decorative timber surrounds. They have no harmful materials in them unlike rockwool and other insulation products. I also put them in the corners of the room for bass traps.https://www.bradfordinsulation.com.au/commercial-and-industrial-insulation/walls/martini-acoustic-polyester-products/martini-absorb I do have spikes on my front mains but they probably would not work as good as your suggestion for dedicated feet. I have my subwoofer sitting on a "Great Gamma V2" made by Auralex https://www.amazon.com.au/Acoustics-v2-Isolation-Platform-Amplifiers/dp/B00O2PMO1W?th=1 . I am mainly using the room for HT and Atmos music, concert DVD's mainly multichannel listening. I don't really listen in 2 channel anymore. For music i also listen in multichannel stereo which sounds fantastic. I love that sound immersion. That's the beauty of this room as it gives you that immersion. Good move in investing in better interconnects. I started making my own which i am so glad i did. Its a rewarding thing to do and you don't need to spend a ton of money to make something good. I followed this guy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uqx6VhWq9E8&ab_channel=Tharbamar

 

[andyr]

On 14/07/2024 at 12:02 PM, drummerboy01 said:

Good move in investing in better interconnects. I started making my own which i am so glad i did. Its a rewarding thing to do and you don't need to spend a ton of money to make something good. I followed this guy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uqx6VhWq9E8&ab_channel=Tharbamar

 

You say "Good move in investing in better interconnects" - yet your link goes to spkr cables???

 

[drummerboy01]

On 16/7/2024 at 9:18 PM, andyr said:

 

You say "Good move in investing in better interconnects" - yet your link goes to spkr cables???

 

Thanks for picking that up. He does interconnects although I could not find his video. I was looking for “Bills cables” here on stereo net but could not find him so instead I found the guy in the video I posted. What ever happened to Bill?

[cerveza_]

On 14/7/2024 at 12:02 PM, drummerboy01 said:

For my panels i used "Martini Absorb HD 100" . They came in a pack of 3 being 2.4m x 1.2m. I cut them into 1.2 x .600m panels. I purchased them through CSR as i have an account with them. I used a sharp knife to cut them with a straight edge piece of timber. They are made of Poly so there is no need to cover them with fabric or decorative timber surrounds. They have no harmful materials in them unlike rockwool and other insulation products. I also put them in the corners of the room for bass traps.https://www.bradfordinsulation.com.au/commercial-and-industrial-insulation/walls/martini-acoustic-polyester-products/martini-absorb I do have spikes on my front mains but they probably would not work as good as your suggestion for dedicated feet. I have my subwoofer sitting on a "Great Gamma V2" made by Auralex https://www.amazon.com.au/Acoustics-v2-Isolation-Platform-Amplifiers/dp/B00O2PMO1W?th=1 . I am mainly using the room for HT and Atmos music, concert DVD's mainly multichannel listening. I don't really listen in 2 channel anymore. For music i also listen in multichannel stereo which sounds fantastic. I love that sound immersion. That's the beauty of this room as it gives you that immersion. Good move in investing in better interconnects. I started making my own which i am so glad i did. Its a rewarding thing to do and you don't need to spend a ton of money to make something good. I followed this guy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uqx6VhWq9E8&ab_channel=Tharbamar

 

Hi what method did you use to hang the panels on the wall? I'm using the same treatment in my room and tried to use double sided tape however the panels eventually fell off! 

[basscleaner]

I'm a little bit surprised for this kind of absorbers use. I didn't find any info about absorption coefficients depends from frequency. The declaration, that panel 75 mm thick has 1.0 absorption means nothing for understanding, how it really works. Moreover, very doubtful, that it may work as bass trap.

[Craigandkim]

On 23/11/2024 at 7:36 AM, cerveza_ said:

Hi what method did you use to hang the panels on the wall? I'm using the same treatment in my room and tried to use double sided tape however the panels eventually fell off! 

Don't need to hang on the wall - make some free standing movable panels.

This allows variable gap from wall to increase frequency absorption coeffients, as well as not marking the wall along with benefit of being movable should you need to reposition speakers.

These are made with same Martini Absorb HD 100

 

[Craigandkim]

On 29/11/2024 at 8:26 PM, basscleaner said:

I didn't find any info about absorption coefficients depends from frequency.

Not too hard to find - http://www.csrmartini.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2024/08/Martini-DataSheet-Absorb_0824.pdf

 

On 29/11/2024 at 8:26 PM, basscleaner said:

Moreover, very doubtful, that it may work as bass trap.

OP is not using panel as a bass trap - using as a 1st reflection panel

Edited December 2, 2024 by Craigandkim

[Kaynin]

On 18/07/2024 at 10:35 AM, drummerboy01 said:

Thanks for picking that up. He does interconnects although I could not find his video. I was looking for “Bills cables” here on stereo net but could not find him so instead I found the guy in the video I posted. What ever happened to Bill?

 

He ended up being a fraudster and shyster.  He ripped off many members here, and matters were pursued through the consumer tribunals in Qld.  Here's the thread banning the sale of his stuff, and it has a link to original thread detailing it all, it's pretty ugly.  If you have any of his products, throw them in the bin.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 3, 2024 by Kaynin

[basscleaner]

On 03/12/2024 at 2:45 AM, Craigandkim said:

Not too hard to find - http://www.csrmartini.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2024/08/Martini-DataSheet-Absorb_0824.pdf

 

OP is not using panel as a bass trap - using as a 1st reflection panel

There are some special conditions for fine tuning, if you dealing with first reflections. The first, directivity of your speaker: SPL vs angle dependence. That's why these table has to be used with big caution, because are there normal or reverberant absorption coefficients? The second, real source is not a point, while any first reflection is not a line. You need to consider the beam divergence and distance between the source and wall, because it fluences absorption panel area. I'm not sure, that one needs to use the such a too high and too narrow panels. The third, big number of such a panels will reduce sound decay and raise your budget, but is it always good? The forth, design of these panels not seems to me good, don't you? Your wife? The fifth, to me the best decision is the panel with variable sound absorption capacity. I don't know are there any producers, who produce such a construction, but I know how it could be made with the remote control function. There is engineers from South Korea, who know this too.