betty boop Posted February 3 Posted February 3 Seems we have a new kid on block with HiFi Rose RS151 Network Streamer which apparently can stream Lossless Apple Music ? something not been possible to this point and the ever solo streamers instead being able to do ...looks like Hifi Rose has caught up in that aspect with this new streamer... https://hifirose.com/RS151 apparently a Gen2 product... and looks like it comes with apple music app on board... so no longer just relying on airplay off phone that cant do lossless ... can see the app there below, apparently you get from the hifi rose app store.. rear view below,
rand129678 Posted February 4 Posted February 4 Apple Music lossless has been available on Android for a long time. So its probably just that Android apk. More interesting would be if it bit perfect
betty boop Posted February 4 Author Posted February 4 6 hours ago, rand129678 said: Apple Music lossless has been available on Android for a long time. So it’s probably just that Android apk. It’s something folks been chasing for a while …see rosehan note in link below on why haven’t to date https://community.roseaudio.kr/t/when-apple-music-lossless-hires-will-be-available/6432/6 from what I understand rose can’t use google apk as don’t use android apart from interface so run their own developed apps from the rosehifi themselves hopefully that comes through as eversolo has done. Eversolo has two apps the google play one that’s still lossy and the eversolo one that’s not as slick but lossless …
rand129678 Posted February 5 Posted February 5 2 hours ago, betty boop said: from what I understand rose can’t use google apk as don’t use android apart from interface so run their own developed apps from the rosehifi themselves Definitely are using the apk, just not using "Hi-Fi Rose products do not use the Android Framework for audio playback" Fiio had a streamer first doing this
betty boop Posted February 5 Author Posted February 5 1 minute ago, rand129678 said: Definitely are using the apk, just not using "Hi-Fi Rose products do not use the Android Framework for audio playback However it can’t do lossless and never been able to …. That’s the issue … will see eversolo and see the a8 thread … it has to use two apps one is apk from google snd lossy… the other is eversolo … looks similar but isn’t and is lossless … Rose hifi has to do the same for lossless and why haven’t been able to date. This is a significant product introduction for this very reason … hope can pull off 3 minutes ago, rand129678 said: Fiio had a streamer first doing this Both fiio and eversolo as I mentioned ….my a8 eversolo does lossless but only using the eversolo app to access …
Kaynin Posted February 5 Posted February 5 @betty boop where is this issue coming from? Apple not playing nice? Price of access too high from manufacturers? I'd look at Apple Music, but native access just doesn't exist, so I rule it out. Amazes me that Apple aren't getting their product out there.
rand129678 Posted February 5 Posted February 5 (edited) 1 hour ago, betty boop said: hat’s the issue … will see eversolo and see the a8 thread … it has to use two apps one is apk from google snd lossy… the other is eversolo … looks similar but isn’t and is lossless … Eversolo is doing a hack, nothing official and looks like they warn it could break any time. Some people in this thread had Apple Music stop working when they updated software. So you wouldn't want to spend all that money on these expensive streamers mainly for Apple Music lossless and then one day it stops working. Edited February 5 by rand129678
betty boop Posted February 5 Author Posted February 5 (edited) 1 hour ago, rand129678 said: Eversolo is doing a hack, nothing official and looks like they warn it could break any time. Some people in this thread had Apple Music stop working when they updated software. So you wouldn't want to spend all that money on these expensive streamers mainly for Apple Music lossless and then one day it stops working. They definitely are … so are fiio and if hifi rose come up with something it will be a hack too… it’s all working around in essence getting unit logged into Apple and playing lossless and mimicking the app on your phone. As can’t airplay lossless … the eversolo works well and just works …the mega dollar a&k dap I had also managed to log into Apple for lossless and did work. So it’s possible and does work. Edited February 5 by betty boop
rand129678 Posted February 5 Posted February 5 2 minutes ago, betty boop said: They definitely are … so are fiio and if hifi rose come up with something it will be a hack too… it’s all working around in essence getting unit logged into Apple and playing lossless and mimicking the app on your phone. As can’t airplay lossless … the eversolo works well and just works …the mega dollar a&k dap I had also managed to log into Apple for lossless and did work. So it’s possible and does work. It seems eversolo warn that it may stop working at any time. I wouldn't be buying any of these hacked products specifically for Apple Music lossless. You are just one update away from an expensive paper weight. Some users in that thread reported their eversolo Apple Music stopped working for them. So it seems hit and miss.
betty boop Posted February 5 Author Posted February 5 2 hours ago, Kaynin said: @betty boop where is this issue coming from? Apple not playing nice? Price of access too high from manufacturers? I'd look at Apple Music, but native access just doesn't exist, so I rule it out. Amazes me that Apple aren't getting their product out there. It’s just Apple and it only thinks of its Apple eco system and makes sure things work within. Things like AirPlay is as far as they have gone but that’s lossy. To get lossless has needed some work around rosehan explains why works on somethings and not others … “ROSEHAN Oct '23 Dear Hi-Fi Rose Users Only Apple hardware or software developed by Apple products and apps support lossless music. Since the app (software) on the Android phone was also developed by Apple, it supports lossless sound sources.” 1
betty boop Posted February 5 Author Posted February 5 2 minutes ago, rand129678 said: It seems eversolo warn that it may stop working at any time. I wouldn't be buying any of these hacked products specifically for Apple Music lossless. You are just one update away from an expensive paper weight. This is concern with all. I don’t know what thread talking about. It it definitely works on eversolo a8 hasn’t stopped working. When o got mine was just matter of doing right update and logging a8 into apple and it works and it’s bloody good ! Look at tidal and its library and it looks like a very poor cousin why I cancelled it …Apple Music library is extensive and lossless sounds great on the a8 as did on my a&k dap I had prior. That’s why folks want lossless Apple Music and will be excellent if comes through on hifi rose. I’ll believe it when see it though
Lil Caesar Posted February 5 Posted February 5 Any device that can access the internet and present as a legitimate Android OS would be able to download and run the Apple Music APK - this is not the technical issue faced by these new streamer manufacturing companies. It's getting the Android OS to then parse the audio stream to their audio hardware both losslessly, and in high resolution. FIIO & Eversolo have customised their versions of Android to achieve this. Up until now, HiFi Rose have run a clean instance of Android over their own software which interfaces to their hardware, which is what has held back their ability to offer Apple Music and/or its Lossless form. The larger question remains, however - if Apple update their APK to check the android install for version and type, it would allow them to "block" playback on a device they did not consider "compliant". 1
betty boop Posted February 5 Author Posted February 5 1 minute ago, Lil Caesar said: Any device that can access the internet and present as a legitimate Android OS would be able to download and run the Apple Music APK - this is not the technical issue faced by these new streamer manufacturing companies. Spot on ! Having Apple Music capable is not the issue ! 2 minutes ago, Lil Caesar said: It's getting the Android OS to then parse the audio stream to their audio hardware both losslessly, Spot on ! Hence presence of app is not enough it’s ability to stream losslessly 3 minutes ago, Lil Caesar said: FIIO & Eversolo have customised their versions of Android to achieve this. Yes I can confirm eversolo a8 works and works well at this for lossless … as does a&k dap I had and both do very good job ! 4 minutes ago, Lil Caesar said: Up until now, HiFi Rose have run a clean instance of Android over their own software which interfaces to their hardware, which is what has held back their ability to offer Apple Music and/or its Lossless form And leads to big questions for me if they will pull off lossless this time as is being suggested ! I hope so as look at the number people been asking for it … 5 minutes ago, Lil Caesar said: The larger question remains, however - if Apple update their APK to check the android install for version and type, it would allow them to "block" playback on a device they did not consider "compliant". Don’t know but seems to be working for a while now suspect until Apple themselves bring out a streamer and make possible there’s no other option though in mean time am glad we have options that work
betty boop Posted February 5 Author Posted February 5 If look at the rs151 manual, will notice while tidal and qobuz mention hi-res the Apple Music app doesn’t say much …just can enjoy various track with no claims of to what quality … even the app is a variation of the Apple music app …this is what eversolo etc does and so you know it’s not the actual Apple Music app but some work around …the real Apple Music app has no Apple symbol or the word music on it …
rand129678 Posted February 5 Posted February 5 I quoted a few posts back: "Hi-Fi Rose products do not use the Android Framework for audio playback" This is how Fiio pulled it off. They bypass Android OS audio framework
betty boop Posted February 5 Author Posted February 5 6 minutes ago, rand129678 said: I quoted a few posts back: Looking at this quote .. the people there are confused … there’s an app on eversolo that yes is capped … but they also have one that accesses Apple Music losslessly . There’s two apps they obviously don’t realise this … see below and this is the lossy one … Eversolo actually installs the Apple Music app by the way for lossless see photos below …direct from Apple so it is legit ! this is from my own a8 eversolo no it works.
rand129678 Posted February 5 Posted February 5 (edited) 4 minutes ago, betty boop said: Looking at this quote .. the people there are confused … there’s an app on eversolo that yes is capped … but they also have one that accesses Apple Music losslessly . There’s two apps they obviously don’t realise this … see below and this is the lossy one … Eversolo actually installs the Apple Music app by the way for lossless see photos below …direct from Apple so it is legit ! this is from my own a8 eversolo no it works. The hires one you can only access physically on the tiny streamer screen yes? This seems not practical. Better by a large iPad that sits on top of DAC. Bit perfect USB output The 44.1kHz is accessed on phone app? Seems much more practical when sitting 4 meters back on couch. But unfortunately not bitperfect hires lossless. Now with macOS i can control my iPhone from Macbook. Which means iPhone can sit on HiFi rack and I can control Apple Music from my couch. That is nice. What we really need is controlling iPhone from iPad.... next step. We are not going to get an Apple streamer for hi-res music. I guess you can do Facetime call from iPad to iPad and now control iPad screen remotely. Clunky but could work Edited February 5 by rand129678
betty boop Posted February 5 Author Posted February 5 1 minute ago, rand129678 said: The hires one you can only access physically on the tiny streamer screen yes? This seems not practical. Better by a large iPad that sits on top of DAC. Bit perfect USB output I am an actual eversolo a8 owner you know Actually you can access on screen the a8 casts the hires to your phone or iPad looks exactly as on player screen I can sit in main listening position with either iPhone or iPad 2 minutes ago, rand129678 said: The 44.1kHz is accessed on phone app? Seems much more practical when sitting 4 meters back on couch. But unfortunately not bitperfect hires lossless. Yeah I do that for lossless too … either phone or iPad … 3 minutes ago, rand129678 said: Now with macOS i can control my iPhone from Macbook. Which means iPhone can sit on HiFi rack and I can control Apple Music from my couch. That is nice. Yeah I do that from phone or iPad from the couch 3 minutes ago, rand129678 said: What we really need is controlling iPhone from iPad.... next step. We are not going to get an Apple streamer for hi-res music. We already got that with eversolo now ie controlling with iPad or iPhone Apple hires streamer yes might never come or if does be gimped like appletv that’s only really good for multichannel atmos etc music mixes
betty boop Posted February 5 Author Posted February 5 2 hours ago, rand129678 said: The hires one you can only access physically on the tiny streamer screen yes? This seems not practical. Better by a large iPad that sits on top of DAC. Bit perfect USB output hi rand, Incase unclear, this is what looks like cast onto phone or iPad and yes as can see it’s lossless
rand129678 Posted February 5 Posted February 5 1 hour ago, betty boop said: hi rand, Incase unclear, this is what looks like cast onto phone or iPad and yes as can see it’s lossless Does it have digital output? Have you verified via digital output into a separate DAC, that the sample rate is correct for various sample rates?
betty boop Posted February 5 Author Posted February 5 1 minute ago, rand129678 said: Does it have digital output? Have you verified via digital output into a separate DAC, that the sample rate is correct for various sample rates? Yes It has been,
rand129678 Posted February 5 Posted February 5 Darko writes: Quote So we have to ask: for how long will the likes of FiiO and Eversolo issue software updates for their Android-based network streamers? The R7 runs Android 10 because, according to FiiO, it comes tied (by their supplier) to the Snapdragon 660 SoC used inside the R7. Unfortunately, Google ceased issuing security updates for Android 10 in March of this year. The Android 11 running on the Eversolo DMP-A6 is still supported by Google — but for how long? We don’t need to ring the alarm bell just yet. An absence of security updates doesn’t render the device unusable overnight but it could, in time, open a security hole in your home network.
betty boop Posted February 5 Author Posted February 5 (edited) 10 minutes ago, rand129678 said: Darko writes: we are talking Hi-Fi rose here or should be what ever anyone’s thoughts are on anything else really doesn’t matter here. In any case at moment as I understand fiio works, and Eversolo a8 as I have indicated works and very well, I don’t personally care about anyone’s could be, maybes or what if the gates of hell open whatever postulating at end of it we need see what hifi rose does in this regard. We haven’t even seen anyone share how Apple Music works on hifi rose 151 let alone on any lossless capability. That’s what am interested in ps likes of darko have lost credibility with me when can’t call out what are very obvious issues with things in the current ! let alone postulating about the future Edited February 5 by betty boop
Recommended Posts