S1000XR Posted April 8 Posted April 8 Hi All, I have a Cinema 30 that is driving my Focal based 5.2.4 surround setup. I recently upgraded my LCR from Chora to Kanta and I want to get the most out of my No2 towers for 2 channel listening. I have 2 options I am considering. 1. Add a Buckeye 3 channel NCX500 to power my LCR and be happy with 2 channel performance after Dirac with Bass Control is run. 2. Add a Marantz Model 30 for LR via HT Bypass and possibly an SACD 30N to match. Opinions wanted on how much of a 2 channel improvement the Model 30 would give me over and above the C30? I dont want to spend money for the sake of it but am happy to spend it if it gets the most out of my Kanta's. Any advice is appreciated.
Hi-Fi Whipped Posted April 9 Posted April 9 Maybe the biggest decision first is whether you prefer the 2ch sound in the room as it is with or without Dirac. adding a 2ch amp for 2ch obviously simplifies the signal and will be better for pure listening but you’ll be forgoing Dirac which can in certain situations produce better overall sound and enjoyment due to the benefit of room eq and sub integration. 2
S1000XR Posted April 9 Author Posted April 9 On 09/04/2025 at 2:31 AM, Hi-Fi Whipped said: Maybe the biggest decision first is whether you prefer the 2ch sound in the room as it is with or without Dirac. adding a 2ch amp for 2ch obviously simplifies the signal and will be better for pure listening but you’ll be forgoing Dirac which can in certain situations produce better overall sound and enjoyment due to the benefit of room eq and sub integration. Expand Thanks for your input. I think you have identified the main issue. Ultimately I am unsure if the Model 30 will definately be an audible improvement for 2 channel listening over the Cinema 30 with Dirac. I am lucky that my room is symetrical with a carpeted floor but of course like all rooms, it isnt perfect. I really enjoy the sound of the C30, with and without Dirac enabled but as always in this hobby, I am wondering if I am getting all I can out of the better quality speakers. I suppose it also comes down to if the high power of the Buckeye will get more from the Kanta's than the better preamp and cleaner signal path of the Model 30. Dirac is the wildcard I suppose. 1
Lil Caesar Posted April 9 Posted April 9 I'd add the power amp and keep the Cinema 30 for Dirac Eq and sub integration. Like you I have a dedicated, symmetrical room and even with mirror-image room treatment and features, it makes a world of difference. 2
S1000XR Posted April 9 Author Posted April 9 On 09/04/2025 at 4:31 AM, Lil Caesar said: I'd add the power amp and keep the Cinema 30 for Dirac Eq and sub integration. Like you I have a dedicated, symmetrical room and even with mirror-image room treatment and features, it makes a world of difference. Expand Thanks for your input. I agree Dirac is impressive. Especially bass control as I am running dual subs. If I added the Model 30 I would have to forgo the subs and just run the towers full range. I am doing this now for music using the C30's 2 channel listening setup as I have found the Kanta 2's to be satisfying for bass on their own. It is so hard to determine if there will be an improvement without being able to audition in your own room with your own gear.
Hi-Fi Whipped Posted Wednesday at 11:38 AM Posted Wednesday at 11:38 AM FWIW Having owned 2ch gear and ht gear over the years all for the quest of the best sound quality I could afford, the biggest game changers I’ve experienced are: 1. Hearing the improvement quality stand alone power amps make over AVR amps. 2. Dirac Live 3. Dual subs integrated with Dirac Live All of the above are non negotiables for the rest of my audio life. You have an amazing setup, and I think a model 30 might even compromise some of what you have, not forgetting the ease of use that comes with having a single system that just sounds great for everything. like @Lil Caesar suggested if it were my money I’d get the power amp, save the money compared to a model 30 and focus on maximising what you have without turning back. For me the scale of sound you get with well integrated subs far surpasses what most towers can achieve on their own, albeit without some of the purity, not that you care when you get it right though. 2
S1000XR Posted Wednesday at 02:03 PM Author Posted Wednesday at 02:03 PM On 09/04/2025 at 11:38 AM, Hi-Fi Whipped said: FWIW Having owned 2ch gear and ht gear over the years all for the quest of the best sound quality I could afford, the biggest game changers I’ve experienced are: 1. Hearing the improvement quality stand alone power amps make over AVR amps. 2. Dirac Live 3. Dual subs integrated with Dirac Live All of the above are non negotiables for the rest of my audio life. You have an amazing setup, and I think a model 30 might even compromise some of what you have, not forgetting the ease of use that comes with having a single system that just sounds great for everything. like @Lil Caesar suggested if it were my money I’d get the power amp, save the money compared to a model 30 and focus on maximising what you have without turning back. For me the scale of sound you get with well integrated subs far surpasses what most towers can achieve on their own, albeit without some of the purity, not that you care when you get it right though. Expand All the points you raise are entirely valid and make alot of sense. Bypassing Dirac for 2 channel is the big unknown and the worst case scenario is buying the Model 30 and then finding out that its not actually better than the C30 with Dirac. Then all i end up with is a very impressive looking but overpriced power amp. Giving my Kanta LCR plenty of clean power with the Buckeye can only help. I might be suffering from ‘grass is always greener’ upgradeitis! I do appreciate the advice. 1
S1000XR Posted Friday at 02:13 AM Author Posted Friday at 02:13 AM A bit of an update... I installed the Buckeye 3 channel NCx500 onto the LCR of my Cinema 30 last night. Pretty unimpressed frankly. It sounds really thin through the midrange and the bass was a major letdown compared to the C30. I have to admit it does sound incredibly clean and airy but it just has no guts to the sound. I was also having to increase the volume 6-10db higher than with the C30 even with the gain switch on high with the same content. It was another surprise as the preamp outputs on the C30 have plenty of voltage. These amps measure amazing and on paper they have power for days but they sure aren't a good pairing with the Kanta's. It's only been a couple of hours of listening and any change should be given more time to adjust to the new sound signature but the anaemic bass alone is a deal breaker for me. And no I didnt run REW or do double blind testing and its certainly not intended as an idictment on Buckeye or the product, its simply subjective observations on what I hear in my room with my setup and speakers. It actually surprised me to realise how good the Kanta's sound on the C30. I know amp topology theoretically shouldn't matter but I wonder if the Kanta's just respond to class A/B better? I guess how the technology is integrated will always have a bearing and the Model 30 may be a better fit but synergy is definitely a thing! What's been your experience with class D?
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