The Harvey Norman Experience

[Max054]

My pennies worth here is that these type of sales people generally get paid reasonable money if they are any good. The I industry averages 1% commission on sales on top of award rates. I work on the corporate side of one of the retailers referred to in the thread! Oh then there are additional bonuses for selling warranties and of course the occasional kick back from suppliers.

[Saxon Hall]

I have worked in sales, I have a technical trade background and I frequent this forum so in most cases I would expect that I would know more about the products (the ones I am interested in) for sale in a particular store than a young poorly trained and underpaid worker. As someone suggested earlier, why would you go to Harvey Norman and ask a lot of technical questions? It is so much easier to do your research beforehand and go there fully equipped with this info. Obviously there are some highly trained sales professionals especially those who specialise in a particular category.

RE JB HiFi. I have got poor service and I have got excellent service. Some staff are disinterested and prefer to chat up the opposite sex and some are genuinely enthusiastic and go out of their way to help. Ditto Harvey Norman.

So no generalisations from me.

[Silent Screamer]

Yeah this sort of "confidence" can be why a lot of retailers have pulled ahead, people THINK they are getting the right products for them, even though they could have spent 50-60% less by buying the actual item they were after. Some will never know they could have got a better deal. In some ways though, its a credit to those that do their research and learn the technologies behind it that often find the best deals/most appropriate products. Just a bit sad when gullable people are often lead that may not have much interest in technology and just want something that works for their budget/money.

 

This is one of my pet gripes with HN. A while ago they were selling the 3 digit model Dennon AVRs that were cheaper and had half the guts ripped out of them, at the same price a friend of mine who owns a proper audio / visual shop was selling the 4 digit models for. He showed me photos between the supposed  "same" models and it was chalk and cheese.

 

My nephew bought the cheap model from HN because he didn't know any difference, but then couldn't take it back because technically there was nothing wrong with it.

 

If they didn't have such huge advertising budgets drawing the unsuspecting public in, people could buy better elsewhere.

 

Edit:

On a sales note if you sell it you should know about it, otherwise leave it to someone who does.

Edited August 8, 2014 by Silent Screamer

[unclemack]

I agree that basic knowledge at least shoud be expected from salespeople in such places however, it's just not possible in that environment to know every feature of every item you sell. We stock maybe eight to ten different recorders and have had training on one, maybe two units. I have been known to hook some up to play with when time permits but, in my store, time doesn't often permit! There are plenty of dumb arses in these box-mover retailers but there are also some knowledgable and genuine staff as well. I think that I am above average when it comes to product knowledge and tech-speak (above the usual staff average that is) but when I don't know, I say "I don't know". Easy. 

 

Sometimes I regret providing great service and knowledge, spending ages guiding the customer to an informed decision so that what they buy matches closley what they wanted to achieve, only to have them, or their partner, find a better price online on their phone and then expect me to smile and match or beat it. They see no problem with this. They are oblivious to the human being they have stooged and the disappointment thay have caused because of their thoughtlessness. It really can be upsetting. 

 

Then there are those who come in with their price from another retailer (no problem there) or an online price (somewhat irksome) and have the nerve to tell me that they'd rather buy from JB...Why? I ask them...and they always tell me they like the service, changeover policies etc...but NOT ONE of them see any value in that because they won't pay a premium to get it... Get it? It's all about price, despite what they say.

 

I could rant on this topic for pages but I wont. I get too hot under the collar.

 

And JB Emos? Please!

 

Cheers

 

M

[joz]

^^LOL.

 

I feel your pain UM.

Just the way of the world I'm afraid.

 

Yes why so many emos?

Edited August 8, 2014 by joz

[unclemack]

^^LOL.

 

I feel your pain UM.

Just the way of the world I'm afraid.

 

Yes why so many emos?

Saying JB is full of Emos is just an old farts way of saying they are to old to understand younger people. It's like those who know nothing about metal calling everything "Death Metal"...just ignorance, that's all. There haven't been any Emos around for years...I think they all topped themselves...ha ha.

 

M

[joz]

There ya go, your right.

They are missing?

[Saxon Hall]

Saying JB is full of Emos is just an old farts way of saying they are to old to understand younger people. It's like those who know nothing about metal calling everything "Death Metal"...just ignorance, that's all. There haven't been any Emos around for years...I think they all topped themselves...ha ha.

 

M

Yeah that's right. They all went off and had a "Romance with their Chemicals"

[Guest]

I rather pay a bit more and get good service.

[Saxon Hall]

I rather pay a bit more and get good service.

Admirable sentiment. However the majority of people are driven to buy by the lowest price, not the best service.

[JukKluk2]

I was under the impression that in a HN store, a salesman was allocated an area, like Whitegoods, or Audio, or Computers, or Cameras, rather than carte blanche over the whole store. 

 

They should be able to field a reasonable question from a reasonably knowledgeable customer and know the answer. That being said, I've never been a salesman, and I have no idea what their training is tailored to, though I suspect it's aimed at making a definite sale out of a possible sale. 

 

A Harvey Norman store is actually a collection of franchises (tv/audio, computers, white goods, furniture etc) under the same roof. That's why you may have to go through two or more sales procedures whenever you purchase a few items from different areas of their stores. Consequently the staff in one area have nothing to do with the staff in another area, apart from sharing the toilets and , probably, the lunchroom.

 

In regards to my OP, I wasn't trying to belittle the staff member who served me as the level of service was actually quite acceptable for the transaction (Me: I'd like that TV please. Sales assistant: Sure, let me just check that I have it in stock.), I was just highlighting a lack of knowledge that we here would take for granted in a specialist store. I wouldn't surprise me if the overwhelming majority of the great unwashed (people in general) would respond to the DAC concept in exactly the same way.

[blackangus]

It's like those who know nothing about metal calling everything "Death Metal"...

M

LIKE!!!

[LogicprObe]

A friend of mine was a serviceman at HN...............it was just as anyone could imagine.

[was_a]

On the few occasions I walk into a mainstream electronics or music store I expect little knowledge from staff and commonplace products that are cheaply manufactured to cover the high costs of advertising and property leases. In other words, mostly crap. However, these big stores make a profit, so obviously the majority of folk are blind to the tactics of big retailers. Scary thought. 

[mello yello]

  Ha! Reminds me of the time I walk into a servo & the bloke on the till says can I help you, the reply was emphatic "NO!" After 5 mins & 3 laps around the fuelstop mart I realise the little bastards have put the tally-ho's behind the counter with all the tobacco. Hey, i gave up ciggy's a long time ago. Well, not to make it too obvious I bought a big packet of crisps & 3 chocolate bars as well as the packet of papers

 

i used to work at a servo and we would have the tally-hos already on the counter waiting for you guys, its the choccies that give you away you know

 

"choccies are there...yes, there...right in front of you...no, ...in front of you..."

Edited August 8, 2014 by mello yello II

[Saxon Hall]

Recently I had a good old chuckle listening to a 'big box" salesperson explaining the merits of a 4K/ Ultra HD (whatever euphemism they care to use) to an older couple. He was trying to upsell them by explaining the much higher resolution that they would get by buying it. What do you watch mainly he asked? Channel 9 they said. Oh well you will get a much better picture then. And so on. Trying to explain to them that such a product would be an expensive exercise in pointless and useless overkill would probably result in being told to mind your own business. This sort of behaviour is what the retailers rely upon. Blessed ignorance.

Closer to home my Bro in Law subscribes to the top tier of Foxtel HD for well over 100 bucks a month. As he is now retired he watches a lot of TV. He has his IQ PVR connected to his HD TV with a crappy cheap composite video cable so he never sees anything in HD. I have offered on numerous occasions to upgrade the connection to HDMI or component but he just says , don't bother. How many people buy top of the line products and then hobble them this way I wonder?

[Cichlabxr]

On the few occasions I walk into a mainstream electronics or music store I expect little knowledge from staff and commonplace products that are cheaply manufactured to cover the high costs of advertising and property leases. In other words, mostly crap. However, these big stores make a profit, so obviously the majority of folk are blind to the tactics of big retailers. Scary thought. 

They aren't just the tactics of big retailers, whoever they may be. Every company manufactures as cheaply as possible and they all have similar costs to cover. There is the knowledge in the specialist stores but not all of them. There are knowledgable people working in some of the "larger" stores as well. They are all in the business of SELLING. The mark-ups for some in this industry are absolutely mind blowing. But they have to be. The cost of retailing has gone through the roof. But please remember one thing profit margins and investment returns are always calculated in percentages.

Edited August 8, 2014 by Cichlabxr

[Saxon Hall]

They aren't just the tactics of big retailers, whoever they may be. Every company manufactures as cheaply as possible and they all have similar costs to cover. There is the knowledge in the specialist stores but not all of them. There are knowledgable people working in some of the "larger" stores as well. They are all in the business of SELLING. The mark-ups for some in this industry are absolutely mind blowing. But they have to be. The cost of retailing has gone through the roof. But please remember one thing profit margins and investment returns are always calculated in percentages.

Of course you are right but what is annoying is the fantasy land that is portrayed in their advertisements. Where they persist in the charade that the customer is the No 1 priority when it is the owners and shareholders who are the actual priority. It has to be this way of course but why all the PR spin and hoopla?

[Juicester]

Your analogy is flawed

Why- because you say so? They aren't paid as specialists they are paid as generalists. What's more; as previously indicated, culpability rests with the employer. But you go on waving your flag...

[JSmith]

How many people buy top of the line products and then hobble them this way I wonder?

 

Many do unfortunately... what is an annoyance to see is when people have the aspect ratio wrong (e.g. 4:3 stretched to 16:9) and/or the picture settings on "dynamic". 

 

JSmith 

[Cichlabxr]

 

why all the PR spin and hoopla?

One of my biggest pet hates. It has become an industry within all industries it seems. But then again maybe I'm too old and too cynical. Used to swear by advice my Dad gave me " Don't always try to buy the cheapest son,like me and your Mum have had to, you get what you pay for."  Alas that doesn't seem to always be the case anymore.

[JohnL]

Hi,

 

 

A mate of mine used to work for Tech2Home.

 

They are the  "PRO"  HT installation guys connected with HN.

 

 

Now the sad bit..............

 

 

 

He used to ring me when he got stuck on a job!!!!!!!

 

 

E.G.... Hey man the sub won't work

 

           You probably plugged the sub I/C in to the M/C in instead of the SUB pre out.

 

           Silence..........Oh yeah cheers dude

[Silent Screamer]

Recently I had a good old chuckle listening to a 'big box" salesperson explaining the merits of a 4K/ Ultra HD (whatever euphemism they care to use) to an older couple. He was trying to upsell them by explaining the much higher resolution that they would get by buying it. What do you watch mainly he asked? Channel 9 they said. Oh well you will get a much better picture then. And so on. Trying to explain to them that such a product would be an expensive exercise in pointless and useless overkill would probably result in being told to mind your own business. This sort of behaviour is what the retailers rely upon. Blessed ignorance.

Closer to home my Bro in Law subscribes to the top tier of Foxtel HD for well over 100 bucks a month. As he is now retired he watches a lot of TV. He has his IQ PVR connected to his HD TV with a crappy cheap composite video cable so he never sees anything in HD. I have offered on numerous occasions to upgrade the connection to HDMI or component but he just says , don't bother. How many people buy top of the line products and then hobble them this way I wonder?

Sadly more often than I cringe to think... I have seen it so many times even within my own family. Basically it comes down to lack of knowledge of the different cable standards. They will replace their old DVD that had composite, component, svideo with one that has HDMI, but they will often leave the old ratty composite cable connected because that is how it was wired up on the old DVD, leaving the brand new HDMI cable wrapped up in the box (or worse not supplied, so they don't buy one to upgrade).

 

They aren't just the tactics of big retailers, whoever they may be. Every company manufactures as cheaply as possible and they all have similar costs to cover. There is the knowledge in the specialist stores but not all of them. There are knowledgable people working in some of the "larger" stores as well. They are all in the business of SELLING. The mark-ups for some in this industry are absolutely mind blowing. But they have to be. The cost of retailing has gone through the roof. But please remember one thing profit margins and investment returns are always calculated in percentages.

 

Sign of changing times where might has become right, and the weak have become prey. Back in the good old days, things like excellent customer service, knowledgeable sales people and realistic prices have gone by the way side, so these gigantic super mega stores can maximise their profits. Half the time the calls are being made by someone that might not even be in the same country.

 

Head Honcho: Your profits haven't grown fast enough this quarter, sell more!

Local Manager: Ok staff we need to start pushing the higher margin products a bit more (so I can get my bonus).

Staff: But what if the customer wants something else.

Local Manager: Its you job to convince them they need the other one.

Staff to customer: This one is much better for you because it has these pretty twinkly lights on it.

 

Vs Local owned HiFi shop

 

Owner: Yes that is one option, but for your system I suggest this one, I don't make as much out of this unit, but it will sound better with your setup.

 

Both keep the doors open except one makes a living, the other makes a killing...

[Upfront]

Both keep the doors open except one makes a living, the other makes a killing...

Hifi shops are dropping like flys mate. Ones making a killing and the other is starving.

[hochopeper]

if I walk in and quote a model number of the device I want and price I'm going to pay, I wish they wouldn't upsell me whatever rubbish they're pushing this week and just take the quick sale and move on to selling something else.

Retail people seem to have no concept of sales volume (qty) and just want to maximise margin on each sale even if they're wasting time that could get them a second sale done meanwhile I'm out the door and avoiding having to politely (at least to start with) tell them no I don't want the 'best sounding headphones in the world' for my phone from the Telstra shop, I just want the phone I asked for.

Edited August 8, 2014 by hochopeper