Osborn T12 Sub

[Tony ray]

That seems a good price for the Sub 1 and if I remember correctly it has very good measurement numbers.

[aasza]

Lifestyle Store in Sydney had an Ex-Demo Paradigm Sub 15 for $2999, may still be available

 

(02) 9683 7222

[Guest Eggcup The Daft]

Eggcup

 

I realise you are just trying to give me advise, but it does come across quite strong.

 

I looked at 2nd hand Eclipse on eBay as they don't come up very often, but after sending the seller 4 messages over a 3 week period and receiving no answer gave up on that idea. Also I showed my wife a photo of the Epitomes and the silence told me a thousand words (yes, they would look better in the flesh, but.......).

 

Regarding 2^nd hand speakers, it wasn’t that many months ago that people were selling 2^nd hand Studio 100’s for slightly more than I paid for a new pair so I don’t think I’ve done to bad. Also my new CC-690 for $1550 isn’t bad for a new one as very little difference from again 2^nd hand one’s on SNA a few months ago (I live in Perth so most 2^nd speakers I would have to add shipping, and no chance to physically inspect, or much comeback if I have a problem with them, whereas at least the Paradigm’s I still have a 5 year warranty and were bought from a local store).

 

I never said I wasn't looking for Mains, Centre, Sub, etc., only that I put a topic in regarding Eclipse/Epitomes. I have corresponded with Greg and to get a new pair of Epitomes delivered to Perth would be the same cost as my Studio 100 mains, CC-690 centre and a REL T9 sub (all brand new). Would these sound as good as the Epitomes???

 

I take it you don’t think much of the Paradigm Studio 100's & CC-690 as you called them "inferior sounding big boxes", and you may be right, they may be inferior to a pair of Epitomes, I wouldn’t know as I can’t get to hear them over here in Perth whereas the Studio’s I did (along with a few other speakers). I've bought Paradigm monitor speakers before so do have a bit of knowledge of the brand, so possibly why I've been subconsciously drawn back this way (it may be the wrong choice, but....).

 

Regarding the sub, I always had a budget up to $2500 for this, but when I saw I could possibly get the Sub1 new for $4100 it was something I thought may be worth looking at as they do have a very good reputation, and the EQ correction software is something I believe would be extremely beneficial.

 

Have I done the right thing with my new set-up, probably not, but I don’t think the Paradigm Studio’s are that bad and it does give me a good option for both music and HT (of course a pair of Epitomes would be better than my new Studio 100’s, but they are virtually double the price for a pair shipped to Perth).

 

I do appreciate all the info supplied on SNA, and I wouldn’t be the first person to have some regrets about what I've bought, but hopefully I haven’t made too many big mistakes (the Studio 100’s do sound good, and my new set-up does give a good option for HT)   

I certainly was abrupt.

 

Let me try to be a bit clearer about what I meant.

 

You gave the impression - to me, anyway - that you had got the new speakers, and were buying more stuff because they weren't doing what you were looking for. I've not been posting here very long, and reading for a little longer. I see lots of people who seem to go through this process - they buy something, are disappointed, and then start buying lots of other items and end up in a mess. As I said, if you were disappointed by your new speakers, the tendancy here is sometimes not to go to the heart of the problem, but to throw more equipment, cables, big amps, at it, but never quite getting there.

 

If you had posted the question "should I buy the Paradigms or the Osborn Epitome at the same price", I would have advised the Epitomes, or most other stereo pairs at the price (that could be driven by your amps and full range output) over the set of four. I don't think I would have been a lone voice, either, by a long way. I took it that you had some knowledge of the Osborn sound, even from some years ago.

 

Reasons? Well, duplication. A good centre speaker is the heart of a surround HT system. But in a stereo setup for movies and music, any speakers that image well will do a better job, than a lesser stereo pair with a centre.

 

The same applies, in this case with the sub. Much of the engineering of the Studio 100 is in the bass. So why buy that part of the product when you are adding a sub? A good two way would have been a better buy for adding a sub to, though. You're paying for the 30-60Hz range twice, when you could have had a better tweeter and probably crossover as well for the same money.

 

You've certainly done well on price and the setup you have, if you are happy with the Studio 100s, all is fine.

I took it that you weren't happy with them and were buying the sub for that reason - my mistake

 

Regarding the sub - I'd ask the dealer who sold you the Studio 100s what to go for.

[Celts88]

Yes, I got new speakers, and after this bought a centre  and now looking at Sub, but that wasn’t because there was an issue with the mains (I hadn’t even received the mains when I bought the centre , but that I always had in the back of my mind an HT set-up. Ok, I keep mentioning music, but just because I didn’t want a set-up wholly based on HT, but able to give the best of both worlds (off course something would have to give, but hopefully my choices didn’t compromise either 2 much).

 

Yes, the Epitomes are a superior speaker to my 100’s, but for the cost of the Epitomes I got mains, centre and $1300 left to go on the Sub. If I was only looking at a 2.0 stereo set-up then this would be a stupid idea, and should spend my money on the mains only, but I want to have the option for HT.

 

I’m sitting here at the moment listening to some music and the 100’s are not doing a bad job (I’m hearing notes that I never heard with my Quad 21L’s). Of course I would have heard more from the Epitomes, but unfortunately I have to think of the WAF. I don’t have the luxury to just get what I want so have to compromise (no one likes doing that, but I get a new hi-fi set-up with no grief, whereas with the Epitomes lots of WAF grief).

 

My 100’s have only had about 50 hours, but to me they are starting to open up, not just on the high’s, but also the lows.

 

I don’t have a problem with your comments, as even if it’s not beneficial to myself there may be someone else reading this thread who get’s good useful info from yourself for their set-up.

 

Yes, most of have a small bit of buyers remorse when we get new gear, and I’m not alone in this, but at the moment I’m just trying to enjoy the gear and let the thought of money drift away on the notes I have heard for the 1^st time on my new 100’s.

 

Regarding the Sub1, you are probably right it possibly doesn’t seem to make sense spending big on this when I could have then put this extra money towards better mains, or went for two ways instead to pair with a sub. Yes, probably would have been better choice, but I think the price I’m getting for the Sub1 is good, and certainly can’t see me needing to change this for a long time (may not have the same longevity with the 100’s, but I think people tend to change theirs main over more than other speakers).

 

Again, I appreciate all comments from everyone, even if I may not always agree with everything said, but it’s always good to put other thoughts/options out there to get us contemplating.

 

Hope everyone has a good weekend, and onwards to the next purchase, opps song I meant say   

[betty boop]

when I bought my first velodyne DD15 some nearly 10 years ago now, the speakers I ran then were even then some 10 year old $2000 speakers. the velodyne is still with me and I got a 2nd some years later. subs ...good gear can stay in your system for eons ...same can happen with speakers...and I subsequently upgraded speakers...but it didn't mean the original combination of sub nd speaker didn't work great and the sub didn't make a very positive contribution to my system for both 2ch and home theatre. buy well and buy once and have a chance of doing that with the sub 1 here I reckon. opportunities dont often come up like that ...and as long as can afford it go for it

[Guest Eggcup The Daft]

I agree, if you are going to add a sub, add a good one. You're almost certainly going to take your system further, and you have then the option to go to a surround system or to support a better main speaker.

[Celts88]

Eggcup

 

Yes, that's what I'm hoping with the Sub1 - it will last me a long time even with any future change of mains.

 

I only have space for one sub in my room (not moving house anytime soon) so makes sense to get best sub I can afford now.

 

Cheers

Celts88

[Jack_]

If you're after an extremely accurate musical sub it's definitely worth considering a Rythmik http://www.rythmikaudio.com/products1.html. I first heard them in the states (where they're more popular), you can get them from www.audiosalon.com.au though. Their distributor here is based in Melbourne though so not sure how easy to be to get an audition. 

 

I trialled SVS, Paradigm, Velodyne and the Rythmik came out on top in the end - for me at least. As they're a small direct to consumer brand you get a lot more bang for your buck too. They're onto something with the direct servo technology, seriously accurate. I was originally in the market for the 12" F12 model (about $1200), but ended up getting a 15" e15hp ($1700). I probably could have settled for the f12 though because I only ever need to have it up about a quarter of the way and it's gut busting even in the open plan space I have it in. You can read plenty about them on forums, hard to find a bad word written. 

[Darren69]

http://www.svsound.com/merlin

[Celts88]

Well I finally pulled the pin on the new Cherry Sub1

 

It's due to arrive next week and have already been told by She who must be obeyed, the only place where it's allowed to go (partly out of sight, but only a foot away from where I was going to put it). Yes, it may not be thee best place (at present), but it allows me to get a Sub that should last me a very long time (famous last words) and one that I won't need to upgrade unless either I win Lotto, or madness set's in; only one of these I've nearly achieved, and will leave you to guess which one

 

 

At present trying to work out set-up for both HT 3.1 (AV Receiver) & Stereo Music 2.1 (Quad 99 pre-amp), should I run:

 

1) Stereo Music - Left/Right RCA outputs from my Quad pre-amp to the stereo RCA inputs on the Sub1

2) HT - LFE RCA from AV receiver (looking at either X3100W or X4100W) to balanced XLR input on the Sub1

 

[roh008]

Congrats on the Sub1! Wow, big upgrade over the initial Subs you were looking at.

 

I'm still contemplating what to get Osborn T12 or one of the TLS from Ascension.. or should I get one with EQ ability to integrate with my speakers for music?

[jibup]

I ve been using the osborn t15 for nearly 20 years and never has it let my down. Gardians of the galaxy on bluray recently gave it a great workout and all the glasses in the kitchen wallunit had to be rearranged, misses wasnt happy but all worth it

Edited May 25, 2015 by jibup

[Guest Eggcup The Daft]

@@roh008

Since you have the Eclipse, contact Greg Osborn who should be able to advise on integrating his models. If your Eclipses are the later models that go down to -3dB at 25Hz, I'd be surprised if you got much benefit from a sub for music anyway.

[Kaynin]

@@roh008

Since you have the Eclipse, contact Greg Osborn who should be able to advise on integrating his models. If your Eclipses are the later models that go down to -3dB at 25Hz, I'd be surprised if you got much benefit from a sub for music anyway.

 

 

Spot on ETD.  I have the Eclipse Mk6 and don't use the T12 for music.  The bass that's delivered from the Eclipse is more than enough, in fact it has to be tamed, if anything.  I've tried integrating the T12, but the Eclipse deliver so much bass anyway, I find it much more natural to keep the subbie off...

 

...for music, that is! 

[Kaynin]

Congrats on the Sub1! Wow, big upgrade over the initial Subs you were looking at.

 

I'm still contemplating what to get Osborn T12 or one of the TLS from Ascension.. or should I get one with EQ ability to integrate with my speakers for music?

 

 

If you're interested, you're welcome to come and have a listen.  T12 + Eclipse Mk6 + NAD T787.

[roh008]

Thanks all for your advice. 

 

I have the..Mk VI I believe..I'll double check. I don't really need it for music unless I'm in a bass head mood. Turning it up the mids/highs dominate a bit. It is mainly for movies though that I need/want it. 

 

The problem with Greg's is the ability to integrate it into 2 sources. One from the Pre-Outs of the Leema and one from the Subwoofer out from the Anthem? @@Kaynin can this be done?